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Old 11-30-2001, 00:47   #1 (permalink)
 
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Read Building a host server,,,,opinions welcome....

Ok here is the scoop.

My father and i are going to build a server to setup at my house.Im building it primarily to get my feet wet as far as all this PC shit is concerned.
Hardware will be as follows...

MSI K7T266MHz FSB w/DDR
AMD K7 266 T-Bird Socket A
1-2 ghz DDR Memory
200gig Hard drive space
Raid setup
Asus V7700 64mb Geforce2 DDR Delux
Extra fans
Polished Aluminium Server case

Reason for the voodoo card is im taping into it with my pc and will be needing that card.

It will be a UNIX system
Other Programs are yet to be announced.

Now i have had the chance to speak with Damon,Gil and a few others.And so far it has been very helpfull information.

Cable modem for now,i will be calling my ISP to see if i can up my service,and see what i can squeze out of them.

Now im VERY green and not quite knowlegdable with software,hardware has always been my thing.So this is my way of learning something new,,,by jumping into it.
I could have this in my house as early as next weekend all setup,but not programed for use.
This is were you guys come in.
Of course ill need people to host.
It wont be free,but i doubt i will have the limitations most places do.So talk to me here.I need to hear from you guys on what i should add,,Do you wish to help me with this??? i could use all the help i can get with it.
Is 200gigs enough?? should i get 400??

let me know,this is something i am doing,more for me than anything else so POSITIVE input is what i would like to see,you can try to talk me out of it,,,but it wont work...

So let me know what i am missing here and if you need a host.
And the programs i should get or that you can help me get to get this launch.


Jim
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Old 11-30-2001, 08:43   #2 (permalink)
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-OK- MSI K7T266MHz FSB w/DDR

-WHAT? - AMD K7 266 T-Bird Socket A
You list all these awesome specs then a 266Mhz processor? Or is it early and I am just reading that wrong (IE: are you referring to its bus speed and not listing its processing speed?)? And on top of that, if your goign to be running a webserver you should be running a dual processor. It will run insanely better and be more efficient if your running a dual processor board with of course -- dual processors.

-OK - 1-2 ghz DDR Memory

-NOT NECESSARY - 200gig Hard drive space
You in no way need a 200gig drive. At work we host hundreds upon hundreds of plain jane websites along with ecommerce sites and other e-applications and we arent even coming close to 25 gig. It all depends on what your going to be hosting but you in no way need that kind of disk space. Put the money that you would have wasted on the harddrive into something else -- like the processor. Also remember, you can have the fastest computer in the world but if you dont have a good hardrive its all worthless. The hardrive needs to be quick and stable -- and able to keep up with the system itself. A system can only feed out information as fast as the hardrive can deliver it. In this case I would suggest looking into a SCSI setup.

-OK -Raid setup
Ok now I am reading this and looking at what I said above. You don't need a Raid setup at this point, unless you for some reason need that 200GB of storage a Raid is another waste of money. Just set yourself up with one or two SCSI hardrives (10-20GB each) and you will be set.

-OK, not needed really but OK - Asus V7700 64mb Geforce2 DDR Delux

-OK - Extra fans
Always think about cooling, the more devices you stick in that case, especially if its a small U case then you're going to need to make sure there is plenty of air being blown through as those devices -- especially in a cramped space -- tend to heat up very quickly.

-OK? - Polished Aluminium Server case
What kind of case? Tower or a U? Or .. desktop?! Remeber, you dont need anything fancy, I've run (temporarily) servers with nothing more then the motherboard sitting on the desk (I don't recommend this).

Ok, I've come to the conclusion that you are off to a good start, however you are putting the most of your money in the wrong areas. Like the hardrive, hardrive controllers, cases, video card etc. You want a good FAST hardrive (20GB is fine -- you dont need 200GB). You want a good hardrive controller (SCSI is perfect -- get RAID out of your head). And a decent case and Video card -- nothing spectacular. Pump this money that you've saved into your processors and motherboard. And remember what I told you when you first confronted me. This is a good thing to do if you want to learn your shit -- but don't expect to really make anything as there is no way you can compete with bigger companies -- which I slave for.

Good luck!
Brian
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Old 11-30-2001, 11:05   #3 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally posted by 89lxprobe

-NOT NECESSARY - 200gig Hard drive space
You in no way need a 200gig drive. At work we host hundreds upon hundreds of plain jane websites along with ecommerce sites and other e-applications and we arent even coming close to 25 gig. It all depends on what your going to be hosting but you in no way need that kind of disk space. Put the money that you would have wasted on the harddrive into something else -- like the processor. Also remember, you can have the fastest computer in the world but if you dont have a good hardrive its all worthless. The hardrive needs to be quick and stable -- and able to keep up with the system itself. A system can only feed out information as fast as the hardrive can deliver it. In this case I wold suggest looking into a SCSI setup.


He'll need the additional storage space for some of the applications he plans on hosting. That would a good reason for him to keep the Raid setup.

-OK - Extra fans
Always think about cooling


I agree.


SCSI is perfect
No comment since I have a personal distate for it.... yanked it out and chucked it across Sunset Blvd.
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Old 11-30-2001, 11:11   #4 (permalink)
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he didnt list any software other then unix.

hell my one server is setup as my primary SQL server which is running databases for about 10 e-commerce sites and 1 auction site. all thats on that system is the DBs, the os (win2k AS) and SQL and its barly breakin that much space. trust me -- HE DOESNT need 200GB of storage nor does he need a RAID setup.
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Old 11-30-2001, 11:55   #5 (permalink)
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The need for RAID depends on how it's setup, he could use RAID 0 striping for mega fast access and a bit of prottection, or set the discs up as mirrors. But only if it's critical. SCSI is better as it doesn't take any CPU time (or such a small amount it's not worth mentioning), IDE does and can jam your whole system as my stupid CD-ROM keeps doing, I might get round to swapping it around one day !!

Oh the 266MHz sounds like 266 FSB to me ! Which is good :s5

Yeah the gfx card is totally unnecessary but if it's a temporary one that's fine.

Get Linux on that baby and away you go !!

Oh, make sure you get a static IP address from your cable provider !
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Old 11-30-2001, 12:29   #6 (permalink)
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i wish i knew how to setup a server because i would i need to learn all this stuff somehow. whats up with the 200gig Merlin? you have that much porn to host................lol
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Old 11-30-2001, 12:51   #7 (permalink)
 
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Ok ,,,,
to answer some questions,and to create some more im going to post this.

Now obviously i dont really know to much about this shit but from what i understand is that there is no dual processor board out there,,not for AMD or Celeron,,,, not until Feburary-late March 2002.
Not unless i want to run Intel Processors,and well.....Intel sucks

[quote]WHAT? - AMD K7 266 T-Bird Socket A
You list all these awesome specs then a 266Mhz processor? Or is it early and I am just reading that wrong (IE: are you referring to its bus speed and not listing its processing speed?)? And on top of that, if your goign to be running a webserver you should be running a dual processor. It will run insanely better and be more efficient if your running a dual processor board with of course -- dual processors. [/qoute]


Whats wrong with the Amd T-bird?
Thought it was a good processor,and yes i think 2 of those on a board would kick ass,,,,and BTW they are 1.7 gig cpu processors not 266,,,,forgot to mention that.


Geeforce 2 card is going in this PC...but im buying it with the other one....

[qoute]-NOT NECESSARY - 200gig Hard drive space
You in no way need a 200gig drive. At work we host hundreds upon hundreds of plain jane websites along with ecommerce sites and other e-applications and we arent even coming close to 25 gig. It all depends on what your going to be hosting but you in no way need that kind of disk space. Put the money that you would have wasted on the harddrive into something else -- like the processor. Also remember, you can have the fastest computer in the world but if you dont have a good hardrive its all worthless. The hardrive needs to be quick and stable -- and able to keep up with the system itself. A system can only feed out information as fast as the hardrive can deliver it. In this case I wold suggest looking into a SCSI setup.
[/qoute]

Now the real question and also where i stand lies with that 200 gigs.

See the way i see it is,,screw it buy it now,,,dont have to worry about it for a long time.
I could partition that out and use 50gigs for my own personall back up space,,,MP3 storage,,files etc,,,

also what if i run across someone who needs ALOT of space.

I want to be able to host an online storage container...much like theplace you store yourshit when you move.
Hence the 200-400 gigs.

Those hard drive are @ 10,000 rpms unless i can find 12,500rpm drives 10k will do

The polished aluminium case is for shits,,just looks nothing else found it for 150.00 at a pc shop,,saw it and been drooling ever since.

No microsoft program will be loaded on this server.
All linux.
Im even converting my pc to linux here soon


IDE?? SCSI??


Ok i know my hard drive are plugged in to an IDE controller pin slot on the board,,,,
Whats SCSI and what is the diff?

im asking,,,,,so you cant laugh if its simple.


Jim
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Old 11-30-2001, 17:46   #8 (permalink)
 
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So what else you guys have for me??
List of Programs i need??? etc.

I do appriciate the help ive gotten so far.

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Old 11-30-2001, 18:05   #9 (permalink)
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STOP POSTING IN THAT FONT SIZE I CANT READ IT!

Ok ,,,,
to answer some questions,and to create some more im going to post this.

I'm fairly certain there are dual processors for AMD. Ok, if there isn't there is a reason -- they aren't that great for server usage. I dont hate em - hell im running an AMD thunderbird in this home pc im on. But for servers you really should rethink your thoughts about Intel, they make good shit, especially their xeon processors (mainly for biz servers). Intel kicks ass and they are voted the best and most popular ESPECIALLY for servers!

Quote:
Now obviously i dont really know to much about this shit but from what i understand is that there is no dual processor board out there,,not for AMD or Celeron,,,, not until Feburary-late March 2002.
Not unless i want to run Intel Processors,and well.....Intel sucks

1.7 is ok, i didnt talk down on AMD you typed 266 so it goofed me up. Thats the bus speed not the processor speed, but you knew that, again read comments above for processor opinions.

Quote:
Whats wrong with the Amd T-bird?
Thought it was a good processor,and yes i think 2 of those on a board would kick ass,,,,and BTW they are 1.7 gig cpu processors not 266,,,,forgot to mention that.
Fine. :)
Quote:
Geeforce 2 card is going in this PC...but im buying it with the other one....

Again, you still do NOT need 200gb. I wouldnt go past 100. I think it will be hard for you yourself to fill up 50gb, unless your a real bad pack rat and never archive shit.

Ok, as far as people storing stuff on your server. we offer something like this at my job, its called remote backup. The remote backup technology is relatively new and still working out the kinks but it can surprise you. I can see how this could fool you into thinking you need 200gb. But you really dont. Heres how our software works. Say you want to use us as your backup provider. We setup the software on your machine, and you pick what you want backed up. Say you have all your docs and db's marked to backup daily. First it sends a full backup, which is archives and compresses, we are looking at about 5:1 compression. So say you have like 500mb of shit, it compresses to a little over 100mb, pretty impressive. now you say what about if it backs up daily -- that would mean 100 a day after a week thats like 700mb! not true. we use a new technology called patch backup. what it does is at night before it backs up it looks at all the files marked for backup, say only 3 have changed, only those 3 are sent to the server. HOWEVER, they really arent. It scans through the file and finds the data areas of the file that changed, and sends those fragments of the file and stores them on the server. So even if you changed a 20mb file, it will only send the changes, compressed at 5:1, so your sending mere kilobytes. pretty slick huh? and you can retrieve backups from each day for life. it also encrypts them, 3 times the encryption level of credit card sales. blowfish log.'s rule :)

Quote:
Now the real question and also where i stand lies with that 200 gigs.

See the way i see it is,,screw it buy it now,,,dont have to worry about it for a long time.
I could partition that out and use 50gigs for my own personall back up space,,,MP3 storage,,files etc,,,

also what if i run across someone who needs ALOT of space.

I want to be able to host an online storage container...much like theplace you store yourshit when you move.
Hence the 200-400 gigs.

Those hard drive are @ 10,000 rpms unless i can find 12,500rpm drives 10k will do

Aight! :)
Quote:
The polished aluminium case is for shits,,just looks nothing else found it for 150.00 at a pc shop,,saw it and been drooling ever since.
Shrug, I prefer MS. :)
Quote:
No microsoft program will be loaded on this server.
All linux.
Im even converting my pc to linux here soon

IDE and SCSI are the methods used to access the hardrive basically. IDE is slower and very unreliable for servers but fine for personal PCs. scuzzy (scsi) on the other hand is able to deliver the data on a much more reliable and faster speed, it is what alot of servers run, unless they need fall backs and SUPER speed and lots of space, then they turn to RAID controllers. but you DO NOT need RAID so get that thought out of your head, its time consuming, expensive, and a waste of time for you as far as i am concerned. so pick yourself up an adaptec (now Roxio) SCSI controller card (unless your MB has one built in) and pick yourself up a good scsi hardrive. mind you the scsi are more expensive then ide drives but are wortth their weight in gold.
Quote:
IDE?? SCSI??


Ok i know my hard drive are plugged in to an IDE controller pin slot on the board,,,,
Whats SCSI and what is the diff?

im asking,,,,,so you cant laugh if its simple.
Hope that helps you out man!
--Brian

AND PS: If you reply in that font again I wont answer you back :grin:
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Old 11-30-2001, 18:47   #10 (permalink)
 
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PAHAHAHA ha ha ha

ok no more font for ya.

Ok i think i am going to go for the SCSI hard drives..i like that idea more.

I knew you understood that it was a 1.7..i forgot until after i made the post,,,was to lazy to fix it..ha ha

But from what ive seen the INTEL's are more expensive,ive seen the MB's for the dule processors and still shiver in excitement when i see them :)

And yes i need RAID as i found some spiders in my house :)


Ill let you know whats up now,ill do more research in the hardware now this weekend before i buy this stuff next week.


Then ill bring it home and slap it together:)

Jim
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