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Old 09-07-2005, 18:50   #1 (permalink)
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Ethanol

The National Party is saying that all fuel should be at least 10% ethanol.
My car will become dangerous and unreliable if ethanol is put in the tank.
About 2 years ago the car developed problems.
It sometimes was difficult to start after standing on a down grade.
On leaving some traffic lights, and in a stream of cars, the road sloped downhill and turned to the right. When I turned the wheel the steering did not respond and the brakes could not be used because of the car behind and the car was heading off the road. The steering had become very heavy because the engine had stopped and I forced the car around the turn and to the side of the road and stopped. It could have been an accident for a less experienced driver.
There was news that some stations were adding cheap additives to make the price cheaper.
It became more frequent for the engine to stop when running down hill and I guessed it could be fuel contaminated with water.
I switched to premium and after a short time the problems disappeared and the car now runs well.
Not sure if some fuel filters are paper, but expect a paper filter would disintegrate if saturated with water.
I tried an experiment.
Into a clear container was placed some petrol.
Next was added some ethanol.
Next was added water.
The result look like normal petrol.
Not sure if the water would stay in the mixture under all conditions.
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Old 09-07-2005, 20:12   #2 (permalink)
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Re: Ethanol

what i should have said is this thread should be moved to a better location so more people can read and youll get more feed back.
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Old 09-08-2005, 01:25   #3 (permalink)
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Re: Ethanol

I think you will find the stuff you bought was el-cheapo crap that had water and maybe OTHER junk in it. I will tell you why - I have bought fuel from a major oil company and had problems - no ethanol it that fuel. Also, I happen to run EXCLUSIVELY E10 petrol (90%petrol 10%ethanol) in my 21 year old efi falcon and I have absolutely NO problems with it at all - in fact, I get similar performance and economy from E10 to what I get from 98 octane fuel ; and at about 10cents a litre less than 98octane it is good value for me. Please do some more research before you blame E10 fuel - it is OK, trust me. Don't believe the nonsense that 'current affairs' shows on TV say. Or your mates who have not done ANY research. E10 is safe for use with most cars provided your fuel system is in good condition - and if your hoses are cracked and your o-rings leaking it should be fixed anyway!

HOWEVER, E20 IS NO GOOD AND WILL DAMAGE YOUR CAR IN THE LONG TERM.

Have a look at the research done for the federal government by the Orbital Engine Company - it should still be somewhere on the net for downloading.

Lets do our bit for the environment - we insist on driving big cars that chew fuel like it is going out of fashion, so the less oil we use the better.

Oldwagon.
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Old 09-08-2005, 18:20   #4 (permalink)
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Re: Ethanol

Old Wagon,
Do you always buy from the same petrol station? Maybe it is free of water.
I was told that some older stations did put water in the bowser tanks to raise the level of the fuel. If fuel containing ethanol was added to that it would become saturated with water.
There would be ways to make it safe.
The petrol tank could have a drain plug.
A water trap could be in the fuel line.
The petrol stations would have to guarantee water free fuel.
All parts of the fuel system would be unaffected by ethanol.
Plus maybe others requirements.
http://64.233.187.104/search?q=cache...++engine&hl=en
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Old 09-09-2005, 04:00   #5 (permalink)
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Re: Ethanol

Most of the time we get our fuel from BP. If the places you are going to put water in the tanks to raise the level of petrol I would never go there! Maybe the servos in my part of the world are LESS shonky than in your parts!
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Old 09-10-2005, 03:39   #6 (permalink)
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Re: Ethanol

I have been running 10% Ethanol fuel for a few months now in my EDXR6, with no problems at all.
No power differance to power, and my economy seems to be slightly better.
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Old 09-10-2005, 09:38   #7 (permalink)
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Re: Ethanol

A lot of people get excited about things the don't need to. Ehtanol is NOT methanol - they are completely different substances. Methanol is the one that will corrode parts etc. Ethanol is the one you drink, methanol is the one that will send you blind...

A while back some servo's were adding toluene to fuel - once again, the 'experts' proclaimed it 'dangerous' and people had a big old sook about it. Thing is, most fuel problems like this are the result of poor maintenance at some servo's, and then some mechanic fixing the stuffed pump etc. and proclaiming it's 'that bloody *insertbrandhere* fuel's fault!'
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Old 09-10-2005, 19:37   #8 (permalink)
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Re: Ethanol

The problem is water and may not be ethanol. The ethanol can cause a water problem and the design of the EA tank makes it worse.
Click this link
http://64.233.187.104/search?q=cache...++engine&hl=en
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Old 09-11-2005, 05:13   #9 (permalink)
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Re: Ethanol

Well, here's my 20 cents worth.

I have dealt with Ethanol derived products for over 15 years. Namely, the "startyabastard or aerostart" brands.
This stuff, is like cocaine to an engine. Once it likes it, its great, but age catches up and pretty soon, it relies on.
Particularly Diesel motors.

I have seen some earthmoving machines that rely so heavily on this stuff, it can take a can to start the engine on a warm day.

Even though, printed on the can, states that "this product has anti knock and extra additives to help your engine start without damaging it."
One of the most underated - misrepresented items on the can.
Dam certain someone will have to sue these companies for misrepresentation.

If you don't believe me, ask a earthmoving contractor, on what Ethanol cans do to the engines.

So, to me, the Ethanol debate is great for an alternate solution, but be aware of it's ramifications if it's not used properly. Don't think short term..
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Old 09-11-2005, 16:40   #10 (permalink)
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Re: Ethanol

Interesting, I've had my car tuned on BP 98 octane, Filled up with the boost 98 ethanol the other day, now at WOT it wont rev over about 3 grand when at 8 psi or more.. Added $20 worth of octane booster, and still no joy. Now I'm just cruising around trying to use the tank load of fuel so I can put the good stuff back in. I cant say I would recommend it at all.. It was just a bit temping at 12c a liter cheaper than BP.
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