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post #1 of 4 (permalink) Old 08-11-04, 09:38 AM Thread Starter
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Holden ESP

On the carpoint reveiw of the it says that although the lower model VZs dont have traction control, ESP and EBD all the hardware is there. Have Holden just disabled this through the ECU? I mean its one thing having more airbags on a higher model as it costs money to put them in, but turning off safety features through software is disgusting. I mean its not like people are going to buy a higher model just for ESP but enabeling it on every model would probably save lives and make the other manufactures hurry up putting it on their cars.
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post #2 of 4 (permalink) Old 08-15-04, 05:33 AM
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Re: Holden ESP

I'd assume they have different sensors too. I think ESP would have a steering angle and yaw rate sensor to go with any others that might be needed.
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post #3 of 4 (permalink) Old 08-15-04, 06:39 AM
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Re: Holden ESP

I belive Bosch askes for money for Holden to use the system, I don't know the exact agreement but it would require development dollars at the very least and then some form of per car payment or total payment or additional cost.

The V8's don't get it until the LS2 because it would require a fairly large effort to include it into the current ecu and systems. Every low series V6's don't get it because they are low series, and the V8's don't have it, either does any other australian sedan.

While it may save lives, some customers may be against it, customers (sometimes police and other organisations) often resisted implimentations of these technologies. Like ABS, like airbags, like traction control.

Like all safety devices, you do end up paying for them. If you want them they are avalible (exclusively on a Holden sedan at this stage). In the 2nd hand market the price diffrence becomes less of a factor.

As for making other manufacturers implimenting it, well, Holden has it on Aclaim, Calais, Statesman and Caprice, Ford has not announced it will have it on Futura, Ghia, Fairlane or LTD for MkII, even tho the Territory uses a variation on the system, and they all have the same engine! Toyota is kinda locked into what ever the rest of the toyota empire is doing, Mitsubishi is a unknown, I can ask a engineer friend who works there.

It wouldn't suprise me if most cars these days actually have all the sensors fitted or could easily be fitted. They might have all the sensors in place because of side air bags. But like most things they will be phased in over time. At the moment on a select models of V6 holdens, then expanding to the V8 models, the the entire range. These things do take moments to develop, Holden took the chance to impliment it with the new V6's. I was kind of hoping Ford would do the same with Mk II and some I6 upgrades, but it looks like that won't be the case.

The only I6 getting a upgrade at this stage is the F6, which apparently has fully operational VCT units, operating much more than in normal I6 tune. It's unclear if Ford has taken this chance to impliment CBC, ESP, EBA on this single low volume model. I doubt it, the perfect time to announce it would be at the MkII "early" launch, to take wind out of Holdens sails. It a unreleased model so Ford would not have any issue with slowing current sales.

The Acclaim is the "safety pack" car, its not much more expensive than a executive, and you get almost every safety feature under the sun. Worth its weight over a Executive. You even get rear parking sensors standard, active head restraints and side airbags as well as ABS, BA, EBA, EBD, ESP, CBC.

I think if we want such features to be included on the next Falcon after BA MkII you would have to lobby Ford directly.
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post #4 of 4 (permalink) Old 08-15-04, 08:04 AM
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Re: Holden ESP

As far as the 175-powered cars are concerned, ESP and CBC are standard on the Acclaim and Berlina but aren't an option on the Exec. The SV6 doesn't get ESP and CBC either.

I'm curious about something, I don't believe Ford has announced anything about the Fairlane or LTD MkII upgrade. It would be nice to think that Ford are up-speccing them to the gills, including DSC.
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