Hsv Boss Chris Payne Is A Little Scared Of Fpv - Ford Forums - Mustang Forum, Ford Trucks, Ford Focus and Ford Cars
Ford Forum Ford Forum

» Auto Insurance
» Featured Product
» Wheel & Tire Center

Go Back   Ford Forums - Mustang Forum, Ford Trucks, Ford Focus and Ford Cars > Ford Cars and PAG Vehicles > Australian Ford's Discussion > FPV & Tickford Forum
Register Home Forum Active Topics Photo Gallery Auto Loans Garage Mark Forums Read Auto Escrow

FPV & Tickford Forum GT, GT-P and all FPV Discussions. Formerly Tickford.

FordForums.com is the premier Ford Forum on the internet. Registered Users do not see the above ads.
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 02-20-2003, 18:22   #1 (permalink)
"Tickford- Own the road"
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Sydney, the best place to be.....
Posts: 299
Hsv Boss Chris Payne Is A Little Scared Of Fpv

HSV BOSS CHRIS PAYNE IS A LITTLE SCARED OF FPV



TAKEN FROM TODAYS (Friday February 21 2003) SYDNEY MORNING HERALD

Blokey brands Holden and Ford are at it again, comparing engine outputs as if they were below-the-belt dimensions. Bill McKinnon reports on the latest round of mud-slinging and skulduggery.
This week's launch of the revived GT Falcon, with which Ford hopes at last to give Holden Special Vehicles some serious competition, signals the start of a yet another performance war of words and of V8 power.

HSV general manager Chris Payne has come out swinging, suggesting that Ford's claimed 290kW from its 5.4-litre V8, used across the GT range, is a questionable figure.

"We don't want to play games with numbers," Payne told Drive. "If Ford's power figures were obtained according to the same standards as ours, their power would be less."

Ford Performance Vehicles managing director David Flint was "not interested" in responding to HSV's claim.

"The last thing in the world I want to get involved in is power figures," said Flint, who has headed Ford's performance arm since its inception in 1991 as Tickford Vehicle Engineering. "The 'mine is bigger than yours' scenario is really, really silly."

Will the GT's marketing push hard on the power button? "It had better not," he said.

The amount of wallop under the bonnet is a sensitive issue in this market. The protagonists are wary of attracting the ire of legislators by emphasising high performance.

It's almost a case of "Don't mention the P word." However, both also acknowledge that power -- lots of it -- is one of the major selling points of their line-ups.

It is no coincidence that HSV's domination of the home-grown hot-rod V8 sector has been greatly assisted by, until recently, a significant power advantage over Ford's rival T Series.

In 2002, HSV sold 3703 cars. The T Series sold in the hundreds.

Ford has tried a couple of times to take on HSV, with little success. The 1999 FTE -- Ford Tickford Experience -- branding exercise was a failure. Much more effort is going Ford Performance Vehicles, the latest moniker.

Dealer numbers have increased from 18 to 66, the GT range is aggressively priced and its V8 now has a claimed 30kW advantage over HSV's 260kW 5.7-litre Gen III V8.

HSV has a 300kW Callaway (US) engineered version of the Gen III, but this starts at $93,500 for the GTS sedan. The Ford V8 is available in the base GT sedan from $59,850, while HSV's base 260kW Clubsport is $58,200.

"It remains to be seen whether FPV will work," said Payne. "We rate their chances better this time because they have copied the HSV business model, and three of our cars feature-for-feature and dollar-for-dollar.

"FTE and T Series didn't work, and dropping that brand name means that its customers have paid the price.

Flint says: "We got the message loud and clear that the T Series cars were not quite what our customers wanted. We had to develop something to match their aspirations. They want cars that are more expressive."

Cue the hero red stripes -- straight from the 1970s -- running down the side of the GT.

Ford's power advantage won't go astray either, suggested Flint. "Some customers want out-and-out power, and for most in the top four or five [priorities].

"We want to be on the same page as HSV, but power alone is not a sensible platform on which to sell cars. It's simple to make a car that goes fast in a straight line and makes your nose bleed."

Flint certainly has HSV in his sights. "HSV has taken Ford customers in the past. We will target and take potential HSV customers."

He also hopes to attract Ford fans who stashed their blue scarves during the joyless AU Falcon years. "We have a heap of people who have been waiting for this," Flint said.

The annual Bathurst enduro, where the Ford and Holden tribes get stuck right into each other on top of Mt Panorama for the weekend, attests to the intensity of this contest.

Recent circulation gains by Australia's two major enthusiast magazines, Wheels and Motor -- which glorify fast Fords and Holdens -- are also an indication that Australia still has plenty of dinky-di petrolheads.

On the back of a string of Holden and/or/ versus Ford covers, the circulation of Wheels jumped 22 percent in the most recent audit to more than 70,000 copies an issue. Motor had a 17 percent rise to more than 60,000.

"FPV is the blue team and HSV is the red team," Flint said. "We're now supporting the blue team in the way our supporters want to be represented."

FPV's website takes a shot at the Holden V8's American origins with this jingoistic little homily. "As the only V8 engine now developed and assembled in Australia [the Boss V8] is also a big advance for the home team."

Sort of. The Ford engine components are made in Canada (as are Australia-bound Gen IIIs) but it is, as Ford claims, assembled here and extensive local engineering has gone into its development.

Despite plenty of evidence to the contrary, both HSV and FPV maintain that they now cater for more than a hoon mindset.

"Power is not the be all and end all," HSV's Payne said. "We always put our effort into creating a driver's package. For the true enthusiast, the GT's performance could be blunted by the overweight nature of the vehicle."

The base GT is rather portly 1827kg. HSV's Clubsport tips the scales at 1660kg; against the clock, the extra metal is likely to compromise the Ford's power advantage.

Payne declined to comment on whether HSV may respond to the GT by packaging more power for less money.

"We will have to wait and see how Ford goes," he said.

"Most of our customers are not looking at the Ford product, but there will be renewed interest which may stimulate the market."

That's code for "We don't think they'll hurt us but if they do we might have to act".

An FPV dealer salesman was Drive.

"The FPV cars will go well. It's always been said that power is important in this class. It's a Catch-22 for us though. You can't be seen as being the slower vehicle, but you can't encourage speed either."

An HSV counterpart acknowledged a legitimate rival in FPV. "We're looking for a bit of competition," he said. "We were lucky for a while, when we had [a more powerful V8] while Ford were still badgering around with a V8 producing less than 200kW."

GT buyers can take an advanced driving course and HSV has similar courses available. The official lines being that these are about safety and skill - a smart ploy to neutralise flak from those who regard more than 250kW of power as a bit excessive and irresponsible.


LINK:

http://www.drive.com.au/news/article...XB9CTZECD.html
__________________
FORD BA FAIRMONT GHIA DRIVER

5.4 litre VCT V8, SSS AUTO, HERRODS EXHAUST, MERCURY SILVER, BLACK LEATHER/INTERIOR, TINTS, SUNROOF, SAT NAV, FORD SCUFF PLATES, GHIA MATS, PREMIUM SOUND, SLIMLINE WEATHER SHIELDS, BONNET PROTECTOR, TOW BAR, BLAH BLAH.......
tickford5400i is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Old 02-20-2003, 20:50   #2 (permalink)
Registered User
 
snavy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: mebourne
Posts: 1,969
why do HSV know that the GTs power is overrated?
snavy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2003, 20:53   #3 (permalink)
Just give me an excuse...
 
Night_Lurker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: struct melbourne hallam;
Age: 34
Posts: 3,949
Chris Payne sounds like John (cretan) Crennan, an arrogant bastard who cannot come up with a proper argument. He can no way say how his cars are better than FPV's. Weight??? Pfft...Good on David Flint I especially liked his comment "We want to be on the same page as HSV, but power alone is not a sensible platform on which to sell cars. It's simple to make a car that goes fast in a straight line and makes your nose bleed." Shows all that HSV can do (except by helping the Australian plastic industry). Go Ford!!
__________________
Truly the deepest kiss one can feel, and the one most sought after, is the one you will not survive....
Night_Lurker is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2003, 20:55   #4 (permalink)
Just give me an excuse...
 
Night_Lurker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: struct melbourne hallam;
Age: 34
Posts: 3,949
Quote:
Originally posted by snavy
why do HSV know that the GTs power is overrated?
Its weired cause according to wheels (not sure of the issue), when the pics of the GT were first released, they said that the 290kw is underrated.
__________________
Truly the deepest kiss one can feel, and the one most sought after, is the one you will not survive....
Night_Lurker is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2003, 20:58   #5 (permalink)
 
XWGT's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 1,079
Hmmmm, if anyone is guilty of over badging cars, its that particular outfit
__________________
Chevs may go, but theres nothing like a HO!
Proud LSUG Member, and 9" Nodular Iron driveline test pilot.
Member FGTCoA
www.falcongtclub.org
XWGT is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2003, 21:10   #6 (permalink)
Movin!
 
Rodderz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Over yonder
Age: 35
Posts: 2,924
/me thinks HSV are getting a slight build up of the you-know-what matter in their trousers. Put in short, they are sh%tting themselves. Not only that, with comments made by payne there, they are also making d$ckheads out of themselves with schoolyard-like comments. They have had market share for years and lately owners have realised just how much they get jibbed on the price they pay for the car they drive.

Quite funny really, it's like the HSV plukes are young kids teasing another kid by saying their dad is a doctor and yours is a labourer....grow up blokes and concentrate on your OWN brand and not getting sour on others. You will earn respect that way
__________________
BAXR8 Ute 5M- 13.51@106.03
zorst, SS Cai,240rwkw
Rodderz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2003, 21:12   #7 (permalink)
CEO - The BSR Group
 
Mr Sparkle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: The sound of 1 cylinder bankï¿
Posts: 4,400
Seems to me that to get into employment at HSV, you need a degree in TalkingAbsoluteShyte. Uncle Cretin leads the pack for this, and surely he's not that stupid to think all his words won't come back on him one day?

Just when you think you've heard it all from the HSV camp... they keep on coming out with some pearlers!!
__________________
Now powered by PCOTY WINNING SR20DET - 32% engine weight, 37% capacity, 50% cylinder count
Clicky clicky here for previous ride! I still miss her!
Mr Sparkle is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2003, 21:22   #8 (permalink)
 
XWGT's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 1,079
The real problem for HSV is that FPV have destroyed their pricing structure and business model, with the excellent pricing of the new products.

The GT-P is $23k cheaper than the GTS300. $23k!!!!!!!
The GT is $33k cheaper!!!!!
And the list goes on

GT to GTS300
XR8 to SS
XR6T to S (as if)

So, the dilema is, how do HSV a) up the power stakes and b) reduce the prices at the same time?
What do they then say to the buyers who bought last year?

As for their ridiculous power claims, as I mentioned in a post before, only HSV would be big enough idiots to start openly advertising bigger power numbers on their cars. The spotlight is already there. The danger of another supercar scare is real, and these dickheads just cant help themselves.

GT lucky to be 290kw? Yeah right. Just like the 350kw Maloo Ute. Um, where is that again? Where can I see one? Where can I buy one?

Their credibility is in the gutter.

Go Geoff. Go David. Do it the best way. Quietly, and methodically :-)
__________________
Chevs may go, but theres nothing like a HO!
Proud LSUG Member, and 9" Nodular Iron driveline test pilot.
Member FGTCoA
www.falcongtclub.org
XWGT is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2003, 21:48   #9 (permalink)
Just give me an excuse...
 
Night_Lurker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: struct melbourne hallam;
Age: 34
Posts: 3,949
Quote:
Originally posted by XWGT

Go Geoff. Go David. Do it the best way. Quietly, and methodically :-)
Exactly, Geoff and David are real gentlemen not kids. The way Geoff and David respond to HSV/Holdens comments is just gold. SAY NOTHING let the product do the talking :) Great Job guys.
__________________
Truly the deepest kiss one can feel, and the one most sought after, is the one you will not survive....
Night_Lurker is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2003, 21:59   #10 (permalink)
GT(-P?) in the plans
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Sydney
Posts: 78
Re: Hsv Boss Chris Payne Is A Little Scared Of Fpv

Quote:
Originally posted by tickford5400i
The base GT is rather portly 1827kg. HSV's Clubsport tips the scales at 1660kg; against the clock, the extra metal is likely to compromise the Ford's power advantage.
*cough* not the VT2 Clubsport @ 1740kg *cough*

And I'd bet my left nut that my one with leather + sunroof is not insignificantly heavier.

Poor HSV, poor poor HSV. A new bully has come to the playground, and they don't know how to deal with them.
lucas is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply

  Ford Forums - Mustang Forum, Ford Trucks, Ford Focus and Ford Cars > Ford Cars and PAG Vehicles > Australian Ford's Discussion > FPV & Tickford Forum



Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
American V-8 Power: Ford Mustang Boss 350 V-10 Stacy94PGT Ford Mustang Forum 3 10-14-2003 18:48
Boss heads US hopes RPO83 Ford Worldwide News 0 02-05-2003 04:47
Transmissions Built to Take on the Boss RPO83 Trans | Driveline 10 01-28-2003 02:45
Falcon XR8 to Continue Sales Momentum RPO83 Australian Falcons 22 01-24-2003 04:40
A New Boss Born in Australia RPO83 Ford Worldwide News 0 10-16-2002 18:12

Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v3.2.2

All times are GMT -7. The time now is 11:02.



Powered by vBulletin® Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.6.0
Garage Plus vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.