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When will we know the weight?

5K views 50 replies 24 participants last post by  Aussie Pete 
#1 ·
It's great that everything has been released. Power = 290kw. But Weight is always a determining factor, and althought I dont think the cars will be that much heavier, I am still very keen on knowing how much these veicles weigh. I guess it will be in MOTOR or Wheels, which ever comes out first.
 
#30 ·
And the rear end in my car sticks like glue on bumpy surfaces . Its the front which needs more stick and that is shared with the new car except that in the new car it has to carry heaps more weight. Have you actually had a good look at both rear suspensions. I know looks arent everything but the beautiful alloy wishbones of the old one must be way more expensive.
 
#31 ·
julian said:
1850KG!!! My girlfriend weighs 50kg so that is like three of her in my TE 50 over and above the driver. Even the GT will be struggling to beat my car in a straight line and the tyres and front suspension are the same so mine has to out handle it. The only place it may excell is top speed and how often do you do that. They have definitely blown it.Not to mention that all the BA range looks too narrow for its length.No wonder the new Xr8 I drove was ho hum on accelleration. The turbo with a few extra pounds boost is looking very good esp at the price. What were we expecting from a truck engine anyway. It was always going to be heavy and needs much more than 290 kw to justify its weight.Why the hell do you need 4 valves per cylinder and quad cams to make less power than an hsv???- and im a ford man through and through. I think we need a weight loss programme across the whole range plus an alloy block plus a better tuned HO- fast.
I actually agree with alot of what you are saying and hope that BA 2 can lose serious kilos. Im hoping for nearly 100kg. The one thing that i dont agree with though is that a T3 can automatically outhandle the GT because the front supspension is the same or because AUs IRS was dearer to make. BA has new geomitry, a wider track and an 88% stiffer chassis which all adds up to make a huge difference. Either way neither car will be disgraced.
 
#32 ·
Jules maaaaaaaatttttteeeeeeeeeeeeeee...

Sounds like someone is trying to stick up for their car a bit here. Just cause a 60k GT will give your car a hiding doesnt mean you have to bag it.

I know I would be spewing too if i bought a T3 for 60+k and then get dragged off by a 40k XR6 Turbo at the lights.

Live with it!

Stop moaning. Barra is a great car. Simple. 400% better than AU.
 
#33 ·
julian said:
1850KG!!! My girlfriend weighs 50kg so that is like three of her in my TE 50 over and above the driver. Even the GT will be struggling to beat my car in a straight line and the tyres and front suspension are the same so mine has to out handle it. The only place it may excell is top speed and how often do you do that. They have definitely blown it.Not to mention that all the BA range looks too narrow for its length.No wonder the new Xr8 I drove was ho hum on accelleration. The turbo with a few extra pounds boost is looking very good esp at the price. What were we expecting from a truck engine anyway. It was always going to be heavy and needs much more than 290 kw to justify its weight.Why the hell do you need 4 valves per cylinder and quad cams to make less power than an hsv???- and im a ford man through and through. I think we need a weight loss programme across the whole range plus an alloy block plus a better tuned HO- fast.
Because you will find it is a new starting point for future 5.4 Falcons to be hightened. i.e. next Gt will probably step up to 310Kw.

Plenty of reserve for the future without to much tooling required.

Think the 5 year plan....
 
#34 ·
From what was posted on this thread in order of power to weight GT being the best p to w.

GT 6.37kg per Kw
VTII R8 manual 6.82kg per Kw
XR8 6.9 kg per Kw
XR6 Turbo auto 7.05kg per Kw
XR6 Turbo manual 7.2 kg per Kw
 
#35 ·
I am not trying to stick up for my car as I wanted a GT (and may still). I kept my series two ten months before getting the T3 and it would be no problem trading on a Gt financially but I have to want the car.

Yes chasis rigidity is important but I bet the weight more than kills any advance. Even more importantly if you cant feel what the tyres are doing via the steering all is lost anyway and I didnt like the steering feel on the Xr8 I drove. It is possible the GT steering may differ (as it did between my series two and three). An engineer i rang at Tickford said effort at wheel is reduced on fairmont/fairlane derrivatives (eg au2 te50 but not Au3TE50 ).

I also realise that in a few years we may see a 350kw derrivative if the government stays out of it. That would be fun but still wont improve handling. Unfortunately the falcon has just become too big.
 
#36 ·
you'll find the handling in real world conditions is fantastic. With that weight I quoted, I am unsure if it had a driver weight in it so will have to check up and find out. I will let you know. One thing the GT has over the T series is the gearing. The manual T series gear spacings were poor where the GT gearing is much better spaced for acceleration and cruising. In the T series cars of AU3, 5th gear was usless.
 
#38 ·
Dont worry Ill drive it but my speculation is at least based on a test drive of an xr8 plus years (im 47) of experience with high performance cars like ferraris turbo supras a 455 buick, many v8 falcons and the like on the road and the track( not to mention motorcycles). Ill be very surprised if the GT isnt as I speculate.It is unlikley to be very different in the handling dept (if at all) than the Xr8.
 
#40 ·
julian said:
Oh yes and the control blade suspension looks like a cheap pressed metal piece of crap compared to the beautiful strong independent rear end on AUs so the weight sure isnt there.
Sorry but don't agree with your coment, as just because something is made out of lighter, pressed steel rather than heavy cast iron doesn't mean the cast stuff is better. And in all honesty, who looks under their car to admire the IRS every day. Not me thats for sure. I notice the differences in the ride and handling, which is why we changed the design. The new IRS craps all over the ride and handling of the AU IRS. I suggest you go for a drive for the weekend in a BA, even a XT and then back into the AU and drive on the same roads. The difference is huge! Smoother quieter, you name it its better.

As for it being stronger, we didn't brake the IRS system during durability testing, where as we did with AU so which ones stronger. Also in a crash I would assume the new IRS will crumple to a degree and not damage the chassis, not so sure about the AU type in a crash.


With the front suspension its the same but the geometry has changed for each model and it corners way better than it should especially in the GT

Just drive one for a while and then you'll feel the differences, but I quess we're all aloud to have our own opinion

:rant:
 
#42 ·
I haven't heard anything, but I'm sure its something they will look into. At the same time though, I don't think they will be able to spend much time and effort on it as we have alot of new stuff happening in the next few years aside from a BAII. Sorry I can't help!
 
#44 ·
HSV GTS has 5.72 kg per kw

GT has 6.37 kg per kw

The sort of people who can afford and buy these cars are not going to be dragging from the lights at every opportunity.

They want pulling power, in-gear accelaration, touring ability, looks, and quality.

The GT has them all, the GTS has some of them, and the Culbsport even less.

Ford will sell every GT they can make, and I think we should all be thankful that Ford is even in the game at all.

GT will be a world class car, and remember, this is effectively Series 1...
 
#45 ·
hi guys,
this is my first post and i had to do this to prove a point. i have my own mechanical repair shop an have for a long time now. i grew up with my father owning a XW GT and always admired the prestige just in those two letters, but saying that up untill now with this new BA i said i would never buy a aussie built car in my life, they were much more inferiour than any other Jap or Euro vehicle on the market.I drove a XT when they arrived in the show room and straight away felt the difference to any other Aussie built car before. it felt like the car was actually made with each piece working with each other and thought well its about time , why did it take Ford to almost keel over to build a proper car. Finally i will now have to eat my words about not buying an aussie car as i Ordered before christmas a GT-P in Blueprint and its killing me with the wait.OH and its not always about the speed, the weight or the times because on any given day as in the times in Motor and Wheels regarding the road test between the XR6T and the SS they had different winners on different days and the times where nowhere near each other.

Mick.R
 
#46 ·
BOSSGT said:
hi guys,
this is my first post and i had to do this to prove a point. i have my own mechanical repair shop an have for a long time now. i grew up with my father owning a XW GT and always admired the prestige just in those two letters, but saying that up untill now with this new BA i said i would never buy a aussie built car in my life, they were much more inferiour than any other Jap or Euro vehicle on the market.I drove a XT when they arrived in the show room and straight away felt the difference to any other Aussie built car before. it felt like the car was actually made with each piece working with each other and thought well its about time , why did it take Ford to almost keel over to build a proper car. Finally i will now have to eat my words about not buying an aussie car as i Ordered before christmas a GT-P in Blueprint and its killing me with the wait.OH and its not always about the speed, the weight or the times because on any given day as in the times in Motor and Wheels regarding the road test between the XR6T and the SS they had different winners on different days and the times where nowhere near each other.

Mick.R
You must get pictures when your beast arrives. Did they give you a delivery date yet?
 
#47 ·
Hmmmm, did any of you guys speak to John Bowe at the Sydney Motor Show or read his comments anywhere? If i can remember correctly he said the car felt quicker, smoother, braked better, handled better blah blah blah than anything hsv or any other australian vehicle on the market today. Now I know he has a job with tickford/fpv, but he doesn't usually lie... he would openly admit a few years ago that the first t series cars weren't as fast as the equivalent hsvs, but handled better. So now he seems to think they are finally faster and still handle better why should we doubt him?

Everyone seems to be so negative lately and I don't understand it... FORD are the ones on a roll with HOLDEN backpeddalling and wondering where they went wrong. Things have not been this good for blue oval fans in years and yet some people seem to be acting like it is worse.

Maybe we should just wait and see what the magazines have to say and go for a ride in one ourselves.
 
#48 ·
Yes COBRA my delivery date is 15 march and i cant stop biting my nails with anticipation. it was supposed to be in february but now they have given me this date. its been a long wait i first ordered the long weekend before bathurst and then upgraded my order just before christmas.i cant wait to catch out those hsv drivers checking it out.

Mick.R
 
#49 ·
Another thread that has split into 356432 separate issues....

Anyhow, I want to make a few comments about suspension here. Having had an AU IRS XR8 I had nothing but praise for the way the rear end stuck like glue even with around 330kW going through it. The predictability was fantastic and the ride/handling equation was a very good one (i never liked the Koni equipped cars though).

Now we have control blade and I see some advantages and some disadvantages. One of the issues with wishbones is that lateral forces are carried by the same members as those that provide the suspension movement. Hence a probable reason why the AU IRS wheel tramped (although if you want REAL wheel tramp drive a Holden/HSV with VW Beetle inspired IRS). Now these forces are supposedly separated meaning bushes can be better tuned, shock rates more accurately calculated, and basically the setup should have better tuning characteristics. AND it's lighter, although that's not an entirely true statement as the AU IRS was heavy because it had to be mounted to a huge subframe with pickup points from a live axle car (would AU design have been lighter had they changed the rear floor to suit? Yes, probably).

At the end of the day, control blade is where we are and it is so far superior in concept, and no doubt execution, than Holden IRS we have no reasons to complain. However, looking at AU IRS it is far closer to what we see on EVERY purpose built race car. That should say something! :read: :wnc:
 
#50 ·
Aussie Pete said:
[B
At the end of the day, control blade is where we are and it is so far superior in concept, and no doubt execution, than Holden IRS we have no reasons to complain. However, looking at AU IRS it is far closer to what we see on EVERY purpose built race car. That should say something! :read: :wnc: [/B]
imagine doing high speed in a holden IRS. me bailing out of that car. as for AU IRS being closer to race car suspension eg V8 supercars do you mean its closer to a beam axle?
 
#51 ·
harasn said:
imagine doing high speed in a holden IRS. me bailing out of that car. as for AU IRS being closer to race car suspension eg V8 supercars do you mean its closer to a beam axle?
I said "purpose built racecar" - not rule driven barges like V8 Supercar :ghey: However, if you want to use that analogy, the front end is double wishbone like the basic concept of AU IRS.
 
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