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Old 06-23-2003, 00:16   #1 (permalink)
Chasing 500rwkw
 
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302 and 351 advice please.

I am currently driving an XF with a worked 250 crossflow in it, COME head, lumpy cam, manifold, Holley 465 etc.Approx 250hp at the fly. I was going to turbocharge a six but have decided i want the sound and tuffness that only an 8 can bring.

I have decided i want an V8 XE and it must be manual, I cant stand autos.

What kind of power would a 351 or 302 put out with just bolt ons like extractors, exhaust and new carby and manifold? What 1/4 mile times would be expected?

I only get 220kms out of a 60 litre tank now so i imagine LPG will be a must seeing it will be daily driven, will this harm performance if i run it on straight gas and recurve the dizzy to suit?
Will LPG impair future modifications? What kind of mileage do you guys get out of your 8's on petrol?
Will i have to run Lead replacement if i buy an XE V8? Is this bad?

Thanks for the help guys and if you have any more advice please let me know, i know practically nothing about v8's.

Thanks
Dan
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Old 06-23-2003, 00:39   #2 (permalink)
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I can answer some of your questions.

Go the 351. You will not regret it.

I had a 351 in my XD. It had a mild cam, Edelbrock inlet manifold, 650 double pumper, extractors and electronic dizzy. It was also on Gas.

I would guess that it had about 280hp on gas, and 350hp on fuel.

The gas intake, was I think rated at 350cfm. It was great for daily driving, and pretty ecomonical.

Flick the button to fuel, and it took on another side. It went from a smooth idle, to a lumpy one. But, when you wanted the most HP from petrol, you had to take the gas top of the carby, as it is very restrictive.

I don't know what 1/4 mile times you would get, as it is very variable, with gearbox and diff ratios. But, 14's should be acheivable.

LPG will not impare future modifications. As it loves high compression ratios. You just have to have hardened valves.

If you want a manual, it must be a Toploader, as you will blow anything else. Put a 9 inch in there while you are at it.

You won't regret getting a V8. If it is on Gas, it will be reasonable cheap to run, and fast.

Oh yeah, nothing beats the cound of a nice 351 Cleveland at redline.

I hope I have helped.

Ken
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Old 06-23-2003, 00:51   #3 (permalink)
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check out the 351 xe in the market. Even if you don't want to buy it; it's got the right bits that you would want.
As for manuals, i always wanted them, but after breaking 4 gearbox's including toploader, and 3 diff's i found it cheaper, faster and easier to use auto's
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Old 06-23-2003, 00:53   #4 (permalink)
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That was very helpful, once i got my eyes off your avatar!

Do XE's come with a toploader standard? I imagine a manual 351/302 will be hard to find. Am i better of buying an auto and converting it?

Im surprised your car was so different when fuels were switched. I might keep dual fuel after hearing that.

How much would it cost to have a 302 stroked to 351? I couldnt do it myself, lack of room and im still a p plater for another year and a half unfortunately. Only insurance would be the issue though as i can always say its a 302 to the police.
My mate has a SLR 5000 mockup with 5 litre badges and a 253 in it and he hasnt had any trouble.

120why- do you mean the XE on straight gas. The one where the guy wants $10000 plus?

Thanks again you have been a big help.
Dan

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Old 06-23-2003, 01:02   #5 (permalink)
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Re: 302 and 351 advice please.

The only difference between a 351 and 302 Cleveland is the stroke length. There is no external markings on the block.

So, to stroke a 302, you put in 351 crank and rods.

Keep the 302 heads for higher compression, which LPG doesn't mind. Or, put on the 351 heads.

I don't know how they check things in Vic. But, the only reasonable way of checking the stroke length of a engine, would be to stick something down the spark plug hole. And if they tried to do that to you, I am sure you would tell them where to go.

So, if you changed a 302 to 351, you may be able to get away with it.

My car ran really really smoothly on LPG. And it was a beast on Petrol. I loved it.

I still have it in fact.
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Old 06-23-2003, 01:35   #6 (permalink)
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Yeah price is a bit steep, but sounds like what your after.If you're gonna use lpg gas research is the only way to make power and a lot of people are too tight or can't afford this system.
TO re-build or stroke your engine and get a GRA system fitted i couldn't see you getting change from $5000
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Old 06-23-2003, 01:57   #7 (permalink)
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Re: 302 and 351 advice please.

XE V8's came out with the 4sp single rail gearbox and borg warner diff. A few have been converted to the 4sp Top Loader and 9inch Diff.


Have a look at this one for sale.
Fs - Xd 351
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Old 06-23-2003, 04:36   #8 (permalink)
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Re: 302 and 351 advice please.

Dan,
I currently have 2 XE's, both 351, one with a single rail box and borg worner diff 2.75 ratio, engine is dual fuel, not a lot of HP fairly std, will only rev to around 4500, runs mainly on gas and really well. I get around 22 liters per 100km/gas.

The other is a little hotter, has a cam with just over .5 lift and revs well to around 5500, toploader and a 9inch diff with 2.75 ratio, (had a 3.5, too much rpm at top speed) I get around 18-20 liters per 100km, on gas. Not sure on the HP but should be over 300, This engine has open chamber heads with around 150psi compression.

Definatley go the 351 and make sure its dual fuel, you'll have heaps of HP and heaps more torque than the 6cyl had.

If you can't afford hardened seats or you don't know if they are, buy a Flash lube kit that runs to the carby it sucks in fluid at the rate of 1mm per litre of gas or fuel, from a 1litre bottle. visit the site and check it out, flashlube.com.au

Hope this helps....Paul
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Old 06-23-2003, 09:28   #9 (permalink)
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Thanks a lot guys.

Wow thats around the same km/litre i am getting now except with gas so less than half the cost and more power to boot. Not to mention the nice sound that goes along with it. Possibly even a friendlier power band than my six (3000-6000).

I think you guys have sold me. What should i be paying for a decent XD or XE with a 351 and a manual? Stock or modified, what should i look out for?

Thanks alot everyone.
Dan
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Old 06-23-2003, 10:41   #10 (permalink)
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Re: 302 and 351 advice please.

You really can't beat V8 Symphony.

One of the guys at work recently sold his Dual Fuel XD 302, Zorst, Extractors, Ultra Low, Decent Pioneer Stereo with RWC for $1500.

Only downside was it was Auto, but damn I wish I'd had $1500 to spare then.
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