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Old 07-15-2004, 05:13   #1 (permalink)
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4V head prices?

Does $1500 for Pair of Bare (no valves etc) 4V Closed Chamber fitted with aluminium port stuffers and a Edelbrock highport intake manifold (for like a set of C302 heads) sound slightly high? What would the manifold fetch by itself?
How about $800 for a stock set of 4V Open chambers that need rebuilding?
Just curious, because i was talking to this guy who had these bits and wanted these $$ for them... He also had a toploader, complete ith shifter, clutch fork etc in good nick for $750...
Anyones thoughts?

Ben
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Old 07-15-2004, 05:34   #2 (permalink)
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Re: 4V head prices?

sounds a tad high but I hey you never get what you want if you don't ask. I wouldn't buy 4V CC bare for $1500. You'd spend about $1500 getting them setup possibly more. Cheaper to go alloy in that case.

$800 for stuffed heads is a waste of $. I wouldn't pay anymore than $400max as you have to redo everything anyway (inc valves, springs etc). Cost depends on whether you stay hydraulic or not.

The top loaders priced reasonably. I wished I got the one I got offered as it was reco with everything for $450. I would have just put some $ on top and resold it to fund other things.

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Old 07-15-2004, 05:50   #3 (permalink)
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Re: 4V head prices?

But from what I've heard, going alloy is a major pain in the ass with intakes and headers...
*and* that price included the High port Edelbrock (SVO?) intake setup for clevo
The OC 4Vs weren't stuffed, just stock....
Ie the headers being move up a 1/4" causes problems in some cars, and the intakes have to be the matching ones? (I *dont* want a highrise, I want to keep the shaker on my XY)

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Old 07-15-2004, 06:01   #4 (permalink)
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Re: 4V head prices?

A secondhand manifold is still a secondhand manifold. I would it to be roughly 50% of what new price was. As it might have been machined to suit a specific block height with those heads. The height may vary on your motor and require machining to seal.

You can still run the shaker with alloys. A mate of mine got a mustang shaker body I think it was. As it's an 1" shorter. Depending on the brand of alloys you went would depend on the support you got regarding your accessories. I still run a Wieand Xcellerator a top of my alloys. Although I'll change that when some extra cash comes in. I know CHI has some ways around it but I am not sure about other manufacturers. You don't have to run the manufactures manifold.

[edit]The exhaust takes any decent exhaust bloke 10 mins to sort.

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Old 07-15-2004, 21:08   #5 (permalink)
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Re: 4V head prices?

Quote:
Originally Posted by GammaBoy
Does $1500 for Pair of Bare (no valves etc) 4V Closed Chamber fitted with aluminium port stuffers and a Edelbrock highport intake manifold (for like a set of C302 heads) sound slightly high? What would the manifold fetch by itself?
How about $800 for a stock set of 4V Open chambers that need rebuilding?
Just curious, because i was talking to this guy who had these bits and wanted these $$ for them... He also had a toploader, complete ith shifter, clutch fork etc in good nick for $750...
Anyones thoughts?

Ben
I wouldnt buy OC heads full stop. They are prone to detonation which is a worry for a lot of Clevo owners.

Providing its ok, the toploader sounds like a deal. I paid $750 alone just to have mine reconditioned. Any sort of shifter at all is worth $200.
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Old 07-15-2004, 21:40   #6 (permalink)
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Re: 4V head prices?

I was kinda thinking that the OC's were a bit pricey for what they were... only really any use to forced induction guys....
Funny, I remeber looking through the Trading post back in adelaide and seeing plenty of TopLoaders for about $500... so $750 is a good price these days.... its a 3 hour round trip to go see this stuff, so....

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Old 07-15-2004, 21:46   #7 (permalink)
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Re: 4V head prices?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Racer
I wouldnt buy OC heads full stop. They are prone to detonation which is a worry for a lot of Clevo owners.

Providing its ok, the toploader sounds like a deal. I paid $750 alone just to have mine reconditioned. Any sort of shifter at all is worth $200.
The OC heads are OK when used with high compression pistons and high quality fuel. Otherwise, a flat top at low compression is about the only way to use an OC head. The key to making them work is highly polishing the chambers to a mirror finish and smoothing out the chamber so that there are only slippery smooth transitions. Also, polish and smooth the tops of the pistons. Absolutely no sharp edges or transitions.

You also need to watch the cam choice for an OC engine. Try to avoid a longer lobe separation angle cam. The F238 and F246 are good choices. You want 110* or narrower if possible.

Also, you will want to push your A/F ratio up to about 12.7:1. This will help decrease detonation at the expense of some power, unless you're pouring 96 octane fuel. With PULP, you will want to have about 31* of total timing, 13* initial with it all in by 2800 RPM. Another useful benefit is to use small diameter extractors with the 4V OC heads. Try the 1-3/4" primaries into 2-1/2" collectors through 2-1/4" tail pipes with an X-over tubes set up.

Over carb the engine slightly. Use at least a 750 DP, but an 800 is a better choice, with a good quality open plenum like a Torker with a 4-hole spacer. A 1-1/2" spacer seems to work the best in my experiences. Do not use a VS carb in a OC head combination. You want all the extra fuel the DP provides.

Prevent (at all costs) hot underhood air from entering the inlet. Directly duct cooler outside air directly into the air filter. Absolutely do not use an open filament air cleaner assembly.

Use heat shielding on your fuel lines.

Focus on porting the exhaust bowls/ports so that you get a really good transition from the chamber through the valve. What you're looking for is the best possible exit strategy. The quicker the exhaust gases get out through the port, the less heat you will see in the chamber. That's why you want to use small diameter extractors, to keep exhaust gas velocities high. The X-over will help to balance the sides so that each side works to help pull the other side.

You can build a very serious OC 4V headed Clevo. You have to really think about keeping the engine running cool by reducing underhood temps through the selection of smart materials. Avoid polished and chromed valve covers, inlet, water pump, etc. Get your heat dealt with and you won't have detonation problems. Use a standard bore block taken to a minimum overbore and certainly not greater than .030". Use as much (unpolished) aluminum as possible to take heat away. Use ceramic coated extractors.

If you've got OC heads, you can use them and make them work. The one thing that is true about them is that they are not even close to being as good as a set of AFD 2Vs or similar alloy heads.


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Old 07-15-2004, 22:22   #8 (permalink)
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Re: 4V head prices?

The intake I believe is either an Edelbrock/SVO A351 or A331
like the ones mentioned here about a 1/4 of the way down the page... they're setup for SVO high port heads on a clevo block...
http://www.panteraplace.com/page35.htm
http://www.panteraplace.com/Pantera%...take%20109.JPG
http://www.panteraplace.com/Pantera%...take%20110.JPG

I figure, given that the port stuffers plus the SVO style manifold are basically a eighties Nascar setup, that the CC heads will be a fairly serious piece of kit if setup with the right bits.... possibly more serious than I want? I only want to put together a stock rodded street motor... 400hp or so at the flywheel...

Ben
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Old 07-18-2004, 03:07   #9 (permalink)
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Re: 4V head prices?

hey gamma boy ive heard tfc are making new 4v heads and they will be under 1500 dollars,,they also have some improvements over the 4v heads so you dont need to add port tounges.

Chheers marty
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Old 07-18-2004, 22:52   #10 (permalink)
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Re: 4V head prices?

Hmmm. OKay. now this is interesting. I have a line on some CC 4V's, fully built big valves, ported, comp cams double springs etc (only got a couple of passes on them), along with a bunch of other bits (cams, valve covers, TCI flexplate)... they'll cost me about $1300-$1400 landed (shipped from the states).
I was figuring on fitting intake tongues ($160Aus?) and was wondering if the 6.5" 4V Funnelweb is going to be too tall with the shorter shaker housing in the XY??
Hmmm $1500 for Alloy heads? I'l lbelieve it when I see it based on the price of the 3Vs etc. Maybe $1500 per head.

Ben
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