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Old 12-13-2004, 00:03   #1 (permalink)
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getting techo

Hi Lads
Id like to start by complementing you all on the types and results of Clevo combo’s people are running , As an absolute Ford nut myself currently driving an XC GXL 302 and a XA GT Hardtop code X(Red Pepper).

My question is regarding the big HP combo’s and the less extreme examples of “streeter’s “ It seems a little antiquated that the level of modification seems to totally bye pass fuel injection... Instead relying on 100 year old technology to meter the life juice to these 10K+ motor’s.

Carburetors are in reality are unreliable, Jetting is not infinite, needle and seat’s???? floats , the effect of acceleration braking and lateral G’s ....emulsion tubes , power vales,, And still if it’s all sorted the motor still just “suck’s” what it can Carburetor’s can only attempt to meter the amount given by only air velocity and vacuum.
Not to mention the no2 boys , Nos is simple as to set up with efi !!!!

Just after your thoughts
This is not meant to offend anyone I’m just curious ...

Either way the Cleveland engine is the stuff of legend and SOLE, You know when you talk about Muscle cars and Bathurst Fords are the first thing to pop into ANYONE’S head.....and the cars they propelled.

Holden’s are Soulless , Drive a ford it ...Talk’s to you ...........
Anyway is anyone out there mucking around with efi on a clevo ??

Cheers fella’s
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Old 12-13-2004, 00:26   #2 (permalink)
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Re: getting techo

The reason most of us don't bother with EFI is:

a) The $5000 just to start a proper EFI setup.
b) Cheaper to upgrade a carb than upgrade EFI when you make more hp
[edit] c) Cheaper to tune

When I talk EFI I talk EFI that will fuel a 500-700hp+ engine. Personally I think EFI on anything less than 400hp is a waste of $.

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Old 12-13-2004, 01:06   #3 (permalink)
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Re: getting techo

Right on brenx. The cost is fairly prohibitive for people on a budget. Most people would agree that efi is the way to go, im sure when efi setup's get cheaper more clevo's will be running it. I know id have it tomorow if someone would give me say $7000. Anyone........
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Old 12-13-2004, 01:27   #4 (permalink)
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Re: getting techo

5K fu%k me drunk.....
yeah if you want the same Motec set-up as a v8 super car IE running 7500rpm every shift, all the time.. they run 600+ HP with out 5.8+L's.

All Iv ever used is Haltech, At the moment my pick is E6K EcU,loom injector harness 8X 13B turbo injectors TPS coolent temp and map sensor plus lift and high press pump surg tank 3/8 fuel line and return, crank angle sensor 3K max.
a 351 running your pick of high rise manifold bosch injector blanks, about 100 bills to have tiged in, cppa blower, I use twin EA throttle bodies, the cam is no big secret nothing different to any other blown engine.
reach in the window in any weather, hit the key for 2 secondes and the pig fires up with perfect a/f ratio and igniton retard,no hesitation no flat spot's mutch better fuel econemy.
The only reasone tuning costs less is the fact there is only so mutch you can do with a carburetor, with the Haltech you tune your engine at every 500rpm for fuel AND spark still the same 70bills an hour just more you can do with efi.
I never meant this to be a brag.. But when I build an engine NOTHING under 100HP per L will do.
An E6k will turn on your fans when you tell it to, It will limit total rpm, it will turn on No2 when you tell it to with-out extra fuel lines, It will data log and give you a print out of all telemetry rpm-boost-coolent temp-throttle posistion-ignition timing-injected mL per second-air fuel ratio.

Consider the Ricer.. SR20 nissan 2LT producing 600HP, Now apply that same technology to a 5.8L and hold the fuc% on.

EFI is not that expensive considering the +'s.

Anyone seen a dyno sheet with 600HP with a FLAT tourqe "CURVE"??
Wake up and smell the methanol boy's.
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Old 12-13-2004, 01:38   #5 (permalink)
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Re: getting techo

I would never inject my GT, it has old technology that puts most new tech stuff in it's place .
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Old 12-13-2004, 02:04   #6 (permalink)
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Re: getting techo

nor would I, My gt is stock as a rock, That's the way It will stay.
I was reffering to modifyed or "worked" engines, The ones people spend big dollars on, Then put a carburetor on top ??
Dos'ent make sence.
All this talk about Dizzy's and modules MSD, Pro-Comp Ect,Ect.. Witch gives better starting witch has a rpm limitter witch will start when flooded.......Emliminate the flooding rpm limit is built in throw away you distributor.
From your throttle bodies run some silicon pipe to the front of your car for cooler air, For Fuc%'s Sake run a Bloody DELCO ecu for a hundred dollars, Still SHIT all over ANY Carb.
You are Wrong if you think EFI is too expensive...Plane Wrong, For the 700 bills spent on a MSD with retard and rpm limit your alread half way there.
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Old 12-13-2004, 02:16   #7 (permalink)
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Re: getting techo

Hmm, made some enquiries via Com Racing re EFI for my clevo early in the year, price they quoted me then was "not less than 6k" - you say 3K, would like to know more, did you source & install the bits yourself ? who handles Haltech
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Old 12-13-2004, 02:35   #8 (permalink)
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Re: getting techo

Shit yeah.
Do the work your self and save $$$$$$
have a look at
haltech.com.au
injectionperfection.com
then have a look at ebay
you'll find everything you need, the injection perfection stuff is good but pricey I think from memory their v8 conversion is around 6-7K but 2-3 of that was throttle bodies and another 2ish was for injectors, I ues EA 70mm TB's at 70bills each from a wrecker good factory ford stuff, and you simply cannot beat mazda 13B turbo injectors for flow, you can pick them up for around 200-300 bill then another 150 to have them serviced,all of a sudden your looking at more like 2-3K for EFI, You could save more by getting a Throttle bodie injection set up from Suburban Imports or Holley and sticking it on your exsisting manifold.
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Old 12-13-2004, 02:40   #9 (permalink)
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Re: getting techo

EFI can be better. I don't think anyone is disputing that.

Yes there can be many benefits to EFI.

Yes it is more expensive.

Yes it can be done cheaply buy shopping around, doing some of it yourself, etc but the same rules apply to carb.

Are you saying carbies are shite??

Whats with all the fu*@s??

The E6K is a fair ECU for the $$ spent, used them and happy, but tell me what the bare minimum would be for a new unit? $1400?

What are injectors worth??

Seconhand you say, well a secondhand 750 for say $300 sounds ok and for 4 bolts and some hose it can run a 600+HP clevo ok....

We aren't disagreeing with you, just trying to let you see the other side. The easy, less hassle, less dollar route.

We hear you, so stop yelling and bashing our ears.
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Old 12-13-2004, 02:55   #10 (permalink)
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Re: getting techo

You misunderstand,
I dont run EFI on my daily ..
But when I see on this forum blokes talking about dynoing there car's with nos and 2-350RWKW's and struggling with fuel pressur leaning out or "made good power but still a bit rich" there has been a number of theads about blow up's due to pining of leaning out and unsafe nos aplications.
To make this sort of power you have to spend the dollars yes?, A carburetor is going to always be the weakest link in most cases.
So what im trying to say is don't you think a $300 dollar carb on a 10+K motor is a bit silly?
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