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Old 06-12-2005, 23:10   #1 (permalink)
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Nothing but bloody problems....

Well I was all ready to fire up the old girl today, carb primed everything ready to go, turn the key and.... nothing. Nothing at all. Battery was on the charge all night so that's not it. Put a test light onto the red + blue wire going to the starter and it goes on when the key turns to Start. Power through the black + yellow wire and through the big blue one. The solenoid doesn't even click when I turn the key. All dash lights working, head lights working and none of them dim when mthe key is turned. I went to pull the plug from my dizzy (key +) nd the wire is bloody hot, to the point of almost melting the insulation. Don't know if this is related (but assume it is) to my problem. I'm at the end of my rope. Not a damn thing has gone right this whole build, and knowing my luck something will break when I finally do get the shitter running. I'm open to suggestions but I'm really dreading someone telling me I'll have to take the starter out.

For the record I have no idea how old the battery is and it's possible that it's just plain worn out, but I highly doubt it doesn't even have enough juice to click the solenoid. I'm so bloody depressed about this whole project, but I'm sure it will be worth it when it's done. It better be.
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Old 06-12-2005, 23:44   #2 (permalink)
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Re: Nothing but bloody problems....

Hello Murphy.

1st, I'll start off by making you feel better.....one of the team!!

Last time I put my engine together I unknowingly squashed and earthed the ignition wire inbetween the bellhousing and block (can't see it from underneath!). Turn key and nothing. Remedy?.........turn key and hold it for longer.........WHOOPFFF. Fried and melted the whole lot. followed by Should have seen all the smoke.

OK,

You charged your battery all night, so I assume its OK? I like to use a $5 hydrometer to check the specific gravity level of the electrolyte, and to reveal a bad cell. Sometimes a charger says 100%, but it needs a lot more.
A real flat battery won't even engage the starter solenoid.

I'd say it sounds like a dodgy starter solenoid or it has a crappy connection (ie: crimp the end connector tighter, it it only has a spade type terminal). Solenoids can also stick, so give it a tap with a spanner.

It's the starter motor that saps the huge current causing all your dash lights to go dim, so its not getting any trons. Is your main starter cable connected from the batt + to the starter?
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Old 06-12-2005, 23:49   #3 (permalink)
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Re: Nothing but bloody problems....

Hydrometer looks like one of these.

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Old 06-12-2005, 23:50   #4 (permalink)
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Re: Nothing but bloody problems....

hey there bud, head up. did u do a complete re wire or just throw the motor in and put everything bak?
dunno bout the hot wire i've only seen that when u cross jumper leads which tell me possibly ur've crossed wires somewhere. trust me i'm no sparky but once i had the same problem without the hot wore thing and i pulled my hair out and it was as simple as taking some paint off the earth strap and it went.
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Old 06-12-2005, 23:52   #5 (permalink)
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Re: Nothing but bloody problems....

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike Gayner
Well I was all ready to fire up the old girl today, carb primed everything ready to go, turn the key and.... nothing. Nothing at all. Battery was on the charge all night so that's not it. Put a test light onto the red + blue wire going to the starter and it goes on when the key turns to Start. Power through the black + yellow wire and through the big blue one. The solenoid doesn't even click when I turn the key. All dash lights working, head lights working and none of them dim when mthe key is turned. I went to pull the plug from my dizzy (key +) nd the wire is bloody hot, to the point of almost melting the insulation. Don't know if this is related (but assume it is) to my problem. I'm at the end of my rope. Not a damn thing has gone right this whole build, and knowing my luck something will break when I finally do get the shitter running. I'm open to suggestions but I'm really dreading someone telling me I'll have to take the starter out.

For the record I have no idea how old the battery is and it's possible that it's just plain worn out, but I highly doubt it doesn't even have enough juice to click the solenoid. I'm so bloody depressed about this whole project, but I'm sure it will be worth it when it's done. It better be.
Auto electrics is not my strong point so I can't really help you. BUT if you got a wire that is getting that hot something is wrong and it sounds like a short.

If your battery is lighting up things like you say and nearly melting a wire its not the battery. Might have something wired up the wrong way by the sounds of it
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Old 06-12-2005, 23:55   #6 (permalink)
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Re: Nothing but bloody problems....

Hi mate thanks for responding! It's pitch black outside now so I'll have to leave it till tomorrow, but I'll certainly have a good look at these things. I know for sure I didn't squash the wire with the bellhousing, but will try tapping the starter and check all connection. The main big fat + wire looks really good but I'll have a look at the other ones. I actually set up a 4 terminal plug right in the middle of the wires to make installation easier for myself, which means there's 8 crimp terminals to go wrong. Seemed like a good idea at the time but I'm not looking forward to having to check all 8 of them.

I'll also go to Repco and buy a hydrometer (thankfully I live 3 mins walk from Repco). I think I'll have to call in sick tomorrow if I want to get this sussed, which will piss my boss off big time. I'm open to any other suggestions anyone has right now as I REALLY want to nail this tomorrow. About that hot dizzy wire, do ballast wires normally get quite hot? I don't have a multimeter so can't check it, but have a feeling it might be a ballast wire which means running a whole new wire from the key to the dizzy as it's a 12 volt coil (coil in cap dizzy).
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Old 06-13-2005, 00:09   #7 (permalink)
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Re: Nothing but bloody problems....

Quote:
Originally Posted by ziggs
hey there bud, head up. did u do a complete re wire or just throw the motor in and put everything bak?
dunno bout the hot wire i've only seen that when u cross jumper leads which tell me possibly ur've crossed wires somewhere. trust me i'm no sparky but once i had the same problem without the hot wore thing and i pulled my hair out and it was as simple as taking some paint off the earth strap and it went.

No I didn't do a rewire, the engine just went back in as is. I wish I had a multimeter so I could test and make sure everything is wired in the right polarity but I don't. Things to do tomorrow include;

Tapping starter motor
Run new coil/dizzy + wire
Triple check all plug connections
Clean all terminals
Check battery condition

If all that fails the starter will have to come out and I'll rebuild it (can't afford new starter). After that I honestly don't know what to do, short of rewiring everything from the battery, through the starter and all the way to the key. I really don't want to have to do that.
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Old 06-13-2005, 00:26   #8 (permalink)
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Re: Nothing but bloody problems....

Another real idiot check is to make sure the inside of your battery clamps/terminals are clean from any crap. Give them a good round file and brush-up.

You can buy a multimeter for $10. Just make sure you check the voltage in parallel and not series, which is all you want to do. Those small cheapos are only rated at about 200mA for checking current (series).
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Old 06-13-2005, 00:55   #9 (permalink)
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Re: Nothing but bloody problems....

Bit hard to diagnose over the 'net..... but, here goes.

1. Falcons have a reisitor wire built in to the harness. It is the red "spongy" one. Works the same as a ballast resistor. If you have put an electronic ignition in (you said 'coil in the cap'), then this wire will not allow enough voltage through. But, the car should still wind over.

2. The starter solenoid should have 4 terminals on it. One is already hooked up to the starter with a small copper strap. His mate is the one the battery lead goes on (these two are pretty obvious, I know...). Then, there are two small terminals. One is the start signal (red and blue wire), and the other is the bypass circuit, which bypasses the resistor wire (mentioned above) during starting (brown wire). If you have the two small wires on the wrong way it won't wind over.

SO, problem #1, get rid of the resistor wire if you have elec ign.
problem #2, swap the wires around and try it.
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Old 06-13-2005, 00:56   #10 (permalink)
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Re: Nothing but bloody problems....

Are you 100% sure all the wires are plugged back up in the same spots as they were before the engine was removed?

Take pics if need be. As I'm putting $ they fault stems from shortying out the battery/alternator earlier this week. Electrics are an area that I can do very well in. I've rewired quite a few cars and other things.

Shaynet need his Cert in auto electrics. I reckon he's on the $ re : short.

[edit 2]RPO 083 may be onto something with the starter wiring too. It's an easy mistake to make.
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