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Old 04-22-2005, 23:06   #1 (permalink)
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confused timing trouble 351C

I purchased a 351C with no dizzy. Have tried the electronic from my 302C with no luck. Got given a twin point out of a 351, but still no good. I have lined up timing marks on the compression stroke. Placed dizzy in, with rotor button on the little mark on dizzy. Put the cap on got number 1, did the firing order anti-clockwise (13726548). Have tried setting the spark on number 1 just before TDC and on topdead with no luck. The inlet and outlet on number 1 cylinder are not rocking, so I am not 180 out I'm sure. Tried new plugs, old plugs, new points, new cap and rotor. Still no luck. Either it backfires out the carby - too far advanced, or out the exhaust - retarded, there is no in between. Did try 180 out - worse. I did hear the motor running, so it does run before I got it. I don't know much about the motor except it has a 4mab crank, edelbrock manifold, 600 holley, big coil and it sounded like it has a mild cam. The timing chain is a bit loose, but not enough to jump a tooth. When I pull the plugs out and crank it, I get an orange spark.
Please help. I have run out of swear words!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Old 04-23-2005, 02:23   #2 (permalink)
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Re: timing trouble 351C

Quote:
Originally Posted by josh_123
I purchased a 351C with no dizzy. Have tried the electronic from my 302C with no luck. Got given a twin point out of a 351, but still no good. I have lined up timing marks on the compression stroke. Placed dizzy in, with rotor button on the little mark on dizzy. Put the cap on got number 1, did the firing order anti-clockwise (13726548). Have tried setting the spark on number 1 just before TDC and on topdead with no luck. The inlet and outlet on number 1 cylinder are not rocking, so I am not 180 out I'm sure. Tried new plugs, old plugs, new points, new cap and rotor. Still no luck. Either it backfires out the carby - too far advanced, or out the exhaust - retarded, there is no in between. Did try 180 out - worse. I did hear the motor running, so it does run before I got it. I don't know much about the motor except it has a 4mab crank, edelbrock manifold, 600 holley, big coil and it sounded like it has a mild cam. The timing chain is a bit loose, but not enough to jump a tooth. When I pull the plugs out and crank it, I get an orange spark.
Please help. I have run out of swear words!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
hi there. just try this. start from scratch. pull out number 1 plug, plug the hole with your finger, have someone crank the engine. when your finger gets pressure behind it, you'll know your on compression stroke.

Line up the harmonic balancer, top dead center, and see where your rotar buttons pointing. it should be right on number 1. if not readjust distributor so it is on number 1. and see what happens.

that should be plenty to start engine.
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Old 04-23-2005, 03:28   #3 (permalink)
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Re: timing trouble 351C

i dont know much about electronic dissies - ill tell you that first

if using a points dizzi , make sure the wire goin to points isnt worn through and earthin out

get someone to crank donk when your moving the dissi around where it should be a a bit , sometimes i find im out a few degrees when lining it up

it is gettin fuel i asume
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Old 04-23-2005, 03:43   #4 (permalink)
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Re: timing trouble 351C

I pulled all the plugs out again and noticed that they all had fuel on them except number 1 and when i line up tdc on the timing gear the mark on the harmonic balencer is about an inch past the mark.
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Old 04-23-2005, 04:05   #5 (permalink)
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Re: timing trouble 351C

have you got the water pump and timing cover and that off?
do you mean that cam mark is down near the crank mark that is up?
ive heard that balancers can come apart and rotate a bit but ive never seen it happen
are you definately on the compression stroke?
look at what the valves are doing when rotating the engine by hand ( clockwise from front) when the inlet shuts , continue turning it over until timing marks on gears line up and then check timing pointer mark
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Old 04-23-2005, 04:09   #6 (permalink)
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Re: timing trouble 351C

i doubt the chain has jumpoed a tooth or two as ive seen chains that can nearly touch eachj other in the center and they havnt jumped , but i suppose it is still possible -
your definately turning engine in right direction? - clockwise from front
you may have to check cam timing if its out
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Old 04-23-2005, 06:16   #7 (permalink)
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Re: timing trouble 351C

one inch past which mark. on the balancer or the dizzy cap. if on balancer, it should be spot on, if its 1 inch past on cap remove dizzy and line it up.
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Old 04-23-2005, 06:58   #8 (permalink)
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Re: timing trouble 351C

1 inch past the mark on the balencer and yes I am turning clockwise and set the cap anti clock.How do I check cam timing? Yes, the cam mark is down and crank mark is up. Today it sounded so close, as soon as i give it fuel, bang! out the carby or pipes some times both.Have done many a time with other cars, never had a problem. But this is my first ford, not a good start! but i will not give up. the next step will be a new cam and lifters if I can't figure it out but that will cost too much at the moment.what about a vacuum leak.yes water pump and rocker covers of the motor
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Old 04-23-2005, 07:13   #9 (permalink)
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Re: timing trouble 351C

Quote:
Originally Posted by josh_123
1 inch past the mark on the balencer and yes I am turning clockwise and set the cap anti clock.How do I check cam timing? Yes, the cam mark is down and crank mark is up. Today it sounded so close, as soon as i give it fuel, bang! out the carby or pipes some times both.Have done many a time with other cars, never had a problem. But this is my first ford, not a good start! but i will not give up. the next step will be a new cam and lifters if I can't figure it out but that will cost too much at the moment.what about a vacuum leak.yes water pump and rocker covers of the motor
it has to be set on tdc, take the dizzy out turn the rotar button so its on number 1
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Old 04-23-2005, 17:44   #10 (permalink)
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Re: timing trouble 351C

your symptoms are excactly the same as mine. i changed the balancer thinking it had spun. same result. did everything you have desribed above. same result. so i run the motor at the point where IT wants to run, regardless of the timing mark. the idle is rough but it revs clean through to 5500 with no problem. i'm thinking the cam hasn't been dialled in correctly, giving me the wrong starting point. this cam will be coming out anyway for something a bit meatier, so i'll live with it for a while.
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