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Twin turbo

10K views 47 replies 8 participants last post by  Aaron_EF8 
#1 ·
I've noticed a few of you guys have twin turbo windsors, I'm thinking of doing this for my next project (my XY wagon goes in for roadworthy next tues). Can anyone recommend a good manifold for a turbo setup on a windsor? running straight gas, so pollution not a problem.
 
#2 ·
#4 · (Edited)
AndrewsXR8 said:
wouldn't running a single mean more complicated exhuast mods? I was thinking turbo each side, into a gas research twin throttle body T shaped adapter that bolts onto a 4 barrel manifold.
I am guessing you are going to plum the turbo compressor outlet direct to the GRA mixers, instead of going to a intercooler? If you are don't do it, the air temp will be to high and LPG hates heat, the LPG's high octane properties will be lost due to heat.

Unlike USA LPG which is straight propane, here in Aus we use crap butane/propane mix which is never consistant, the butane is crap with a lower RON than unleaded petrol. So you don't have that magic told 105RON that we are normally told about.

I think ebxr8240 is saying a single is easier because of an intercooler etc pluming and oil fittings. Only pluming downfall is one exhaust bank traveling all the way over to the other side.

If you wanted a shorter intake pluming setup with a twin turbo is to use a water to air intercooler, which is normally dearer and more weight (but awesome for drag racing etc as you use a tank to hold iced water etc)
 
#7 ·
AndrewsXR8 said:
Thanks for the info on the gas, that was my plan. The aftercoolers on that page are basically a remote intercooler? am i right? sort of like how an air conditioning system works?
Yep, they are just water intercoolers, there is a little electric water pump and a radiator used in the front of the engine radiator, that cools the water medium then cools the intake air, the bonus is if you a drag racing or going in a dyno comp, you fill a reservoir tank with ice and stop the water flowing to the radiator, as the air cooling it will be higher temp than the ice water, other wise it becomes a heater of the water. Big horsepower gains then!

(Aircon uses a gas, which is a much more complex system)

I wish I was rich and could afford one of these!

Igloo Mondo Cooler Racing Package
Innovative modular design for use with the most popular Ford 5.0L EFI Lower manifold types including the Ford 5.0 truck, SVO 5.0 or 5.8 GT-40 and TFS-R (also available is a universal model to fit custom applications). Unmatched race proven performance for today's supercharged or turbocharged racing engines. This premium air/water system allows ice-chilled water to drastically reduce the charge air temperature entering the engine. It features a triple-core double pass internal layout for superior cooling along with minimal pressure drop, resulting in substantial increases in usable horsepower and torque. This system is capable of flowing in excess of 2,500 CFM for applications producing 1,700+ HP. Patent Pending.
 
#8 ·
Yeah, it would be nice to have an unlimited budget. but we've gotta make do with what we've got i guess. any idea on what the RON of aussie gas actually is? I was hoping to avoid any problems with the EPA by going straight gas, so i would hate to rebuild the engine only to find that my compressions to high to run gas with even a half decent amount of boost.
 
#9 · (Edited)
AndrewsXR8 said:
Yeah, it would be nice to have an unlimited budget. but we've gotta make do with what we've got i guess. any idea on what the RON of aussie gas actually is? I was hoping to avoid any problems with the EPA by going straight gas, so i would hate to rebuild the engine only to find that my compressions to high to run gas with even a half decent amount of boost.
It would be all over the place depending on butane mixture rates.
Like all fuels we should be told MON not RON as that gives us a better idea how good it is.
Hey don't think I am putting down LPG, just look at my avatar, just I won't hide problems with things like others might! I am pissed with the mix we Aussies get. Anyway it will most likely have a higher octane than PULP if you keep the intake temp down, unlike petrol, gas goes into the intake as a dry fuel, petrol goes in as a wet fuel, it becomes the gas in the combustion camber, that change absorbs latent heat (similar to how the gas in an air conditioner system works), gas goes in dry so this never happens, also a wetting of the intake walls with petrol cools the intake charge. Sorry for my poor explanation.

Keep the intake temps down and you should out perform PULP petrol that is not using any additives as this will allow higher boost.

Not to mention you will be using a fuel that is better for the environment, increased engine life and cheaper.

Damn hard to kill yourself with LPG if running your car in a shed, as it produces very little carbon monoxide and far less carbon dioxide.

http://www.gas-injection.com/index.htm , check this site out, they have some interesting results.

I reckon I could make one of those intercooler intakes if I had better pics or the design. ( :s6: Well I reckon my mate could and I help! :s5)
 
#11 ·
AndrewsXR8 said:
yeah, they don't look too complicated. I'm a sheetmetal worker, so making up the box and all the plumbing wouldn't be a problem. electric water-pump, big transcooler...not too hard at all.
Pity you don't live close to me! :bang:

My best mate is a welder and has made that sort of stuff up before, problem we would have is distance (Brisbane) and he doesn’t work in a workshop that does TIG and sheet metal work.

Do you feel like making one for your own XR8, you could sell them to Ford forum members. :hehe:

I would like to build one for a 351 Windsor including a totally new intake that uses open runners and separate water outlets. :hungry:
 
#12 ·
well i've got access to TIGS, and can make the stuff no worries, but my boss is an absolute prick, it would be easier to catch bin laden than smuggle something out of the workshop..but i might have a play around with a few bits and pieces at home, MIG it together just to see if it works.
 
#13 ·
With twin turbo's you have to relocate air conditioner compressor to other side for there is no room. A X over is easier [as in wrx's] can use existing shorties left to right and put on backwards bending and fabing to fit bend down to make x over. Not sure how lpg works but with efi one maf before turbo and esier to make room for one big hairdrier [clearance's] than two..But realy it doesn't matter...
 
#14 ·
ebxr8240 said:
With twin turbo's you have to relocate air conditioner compressor to other side for there is no room. A X over is easier [as in wrx's] can use existing shorties left to right and put on backwards bending and fabing to fit bend down to make x over. Not sure how lpg works but with efi one maf before turbo and esier to make room for one big hairdrier [clearance's] than two..But realy it doesn't matter...
That should clear it up why it is easier to fit one than two!
 
#16 ·
I started making a rough design without measurements etc, just to give me an idea what I wanted, but I got stuck.

How would a similar setup to this Vortech one cool the air evenly?

I am stumped, the Vortech picture doesn’t show much to help me get an idea of the water flow design, normal intercoolers don't have this problem because they pump the air into the plenum then it is distributed to the cylinders, I am guessing I would have trouble designing way to evenly flow the coolant so the air is cooled evenly or am I just worrying to much.

This is the start of it! It was done in Paintshop Pro to allow removal sections I added!
"Click on here to download my rough intake design saved as a PSP file"
Feel free if you want to modify the design or make a totally new design, then email it or post it on here for me to get ideas.

I might even change this drawing as I change my mind about it


I know that it will require bonnet hump etc, but you get that!
 
#18 ·
AndrewsXR8 said:
Something like this maybe, connected to an external water cooler. I miss Autocad, MS paint just doesn't make it as much fun.
Thanks mate, I will add that to my list of ideas, still not sure that would cool the intake air evenly?

MS paint is a bastard for drawing with, you did well to do that!
 
#19 ·
Look up Paul Weel Racing (PWR) as Laminge has one of their water to air intercoolers on his T3. The better solution is to run the intercooler across the front of the engine bay or it can even be mounted in the front guards/bumper side areas.
 
#20 ·
#21 ·
Aussie Pete said:
Look up Paul Weel Racing (PWR) as Laminge has one of their water to air intercoolers on his T3. The better solution is to run the intercooler across the front of the engine bay or it can even be mounted in the front guards/bumper side areas.
Funny you should say look up Paul Weel Racing website, I pissed them off last night with a email about their website. :twitch:
 
#22 ·
ebxr8240 said:
Nah you know I know how your system is setup, considering that I took one of those pictures. :s6:

I am trying to get ideas on designs of a water to air intercooler setup, if I still had to set it up so far from the intake I wouldn't bother, I would just run a air to air like yours, which there is nothing wrong with.
 
#23 · (Edited)
Depends what you want? There is a guy down Wollongong that has a blown E.L six with a tank in boot filled with cold water/ ice. With an air-water intercooler up front with a pump/ pipes between the two.Not sure if he used air con to help cool rear tank? Ideal for drags etc.. Not long runs though. Hmm time I updated my pics...

I think it was featured in Performance Ford Mag..
 
#24 ·
ebxr8240 said:
Depends what you want? There is a guy down Wollongong that has a blown E.L six with a tank in boot filled with cold water/ ice. With an air-water intercooler up front with a pump/ pipes between the two.Not sure if he used air con to help cool rear tank? Ideal for drags etc.. Not long runs though. Hmm time I updated my pics...

I think it was featured in Performance Ford Mag..
Was that the XR6 EL that used it aircon to cool the blower air??
Or was that a XR8 EL?
 
#25 ·
damage181 said:
Was that the XR6 EL that used it aircon to cool the blower air??
Or was that a XR8 EL?
Vol 2 edition 2 page 74 Teachers Pet- E.F Futura with body kit.. Dark blue Au xr6 on cover..
 
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