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handling upgrades?

7K views 26 replies 14 participants last post by  ZC-Cruiser 
#1 ·
what type of front end/ steering/ suspension upgrades are around for XY or Xa,b,or xc are available to make the handling better.

i used to own a non power steering XD, and wouldn't mind it at least as good if not better, because this project will be my only non 4x4, i'd like something with looks and power (check and check) but something i can punt along some twisty roads, or up a mountain road, with a smile on the face
 
#3 ·
hmm 6 grand + power steering pump etc... then i gotta tie down the rear live axle

now i gotta decide whether i'll race it or keep it for cruising :)

what do people think about using some good brand A arms instead of the struts, and using the rack and penut (pinion) steering from them?
 
#4 ·
The A arms arn't that bad
rebuilding the lot is a good start.
Use urethane bush's on the UCA's /swaybar and rubber on the LCA's and strut rods's
Urethane is supposed to be to hard for the LCA/strut rod and can cause binding.
Replace the camber adjusters with ones that cant adjust themselves over time.
upgrade the front sway bar and springs
Losing a bit of ride height not all of it, will also help
The rack/pinion will make a big difference getting rid of flex /wear from the factory
setup.
Use urethane on the front leaf spring Bushes and rubber on the shackles
Use a correctly fitted panhard bar( it has to pass through the roll center of the car?)
Opinions any one? as this is also what i am plan to do myself and other than reinventing the wheel should be enough for a licenced road car.
 
#5 ·
I found I could keep up with a modded R32 skyline in my old XB through the hills @ 80-140kph. The only suspension mods were reasonable front tyres, lowered 2", nolethane "A" arm bushes, nolethane on the ends of the front stock sway bar, nolethane in the upper suspension arm, nolethane through-out the leaf springs and added 2 more leaf springs to the pack. I had 6 springs in the pack. Body roll? Nope.

I ran 16*8" rims too just incase.

I changed the front tyres as my front tyres failed due to camber bolt failure. Now it corners woeful. It goes straight and not around the corner. While I am drag racing thats fine but on the street it's annoying. So new tyres on the front are in order.

Brenden
 
#7 ·
You can basically use XF parts though-out as they are the same. Supposedly the upper suspension arm is different (longer) but all I found is it was non-servicable in an XF. Where XB/C had grease nipples. Grease nipples are good for stopping that squeaky front end.

Brenden
 
#8 ·
302xm said:
The A arms arn't that bad
rebuilding the lot is a good start.
Use urethane bush's on the UCA's /swaybar and rubber on the LCA's and strut rods's
Urethane is supposed to be to hard for the LCA/strut rod and can cause binding.
Replace the camber adjusters with ones that cant adjust themselves over time.
upgrade the front sway bar and springs
Losing a bit of ride height not all of it, will also help
The rack/pinion will make a big difference getting rid of flex /wear from the factory
setup.
Use urethane on the front leaf spring Bushes and rubber on the shackles
Use a correctly fitted panhard bar( it has to pass through the roll center of the car?)
Opinions any one? as this is also what i am plan to do myself and other than reinventing the wheel should be enough for a licenced road car.
I agree on most of your points here 302 xm but i have heard of cases where people have installed nolathane bushings everywhere in the front and then reverted back to the original rubber because the ride was just too harsh.I am in the process of doing my front suspension and here is what i have been told. Firstly ,lowering your upper control arm mounting points by one inch is a worthwhile mod and costs nothing if you do it yourself.Secondly ,i am using xc upper control arms in my xr.The RRS option looks the goods here but alas my chequebook is not that healthy.I have opted to use the standard setup albeit somewhat modified and have been assured it will work great.As for the steering the original setup has been binned and the rack and pinion from RRs is definately on the cards here.The original setup is just too sloppy for my liking.
 
#9 ·
brenx said:
I changed the front tyres as my front tyres failed due to camber bolt failure. Now it corners woeful. It goes straight and not around the corner. While I am drag racing thats fine but on the street it's annoying. So new tyres on the front are in order.

Brenden
Use a fine threaded camber bolt, with nice tight fitting cams.
Then tack weld them in place when you have it aligned properly.
That's the only way I ever had them stay in place when I peddled the car hard.

Rick.
 
#11 · (Edited)
rusxr67
your spot on with the harsh ride on rough roads. my car presently has nolethane throughout the front and i think i'm starting to tense up every time i see a railway crossing or speed bump or crack in tar seal :fraz: .I want to change back to rubber on the spring saddle to soften the force that is being transmited through it as well as rubber on the lower control arm and strut rod as deal with any binding problem ive heard about ,but keep the nolethane in the upper arms and sway bar to try and control the camber curve as best as possible.
Has any one used the camber bolts advertised for falcons mustangs that instead of a cam it uses a square washer with two holes that when rotated 90deg adjusted the camber x degrees by moving the bolt left or right. by the looks it fixs the self adjusting camber bolt permanatly and still be adjustable.
Thunderkiss thats an excellent link and was the one that finally convienced me to do the upper control arm drop myself a while back and definitly the best thing ive ever done to falcon suspension so far.I Made the template drilled the holes andspent hours with a grinder and file making wedges to correct balljoint angle , but it was time well spent by the way the car now handles in corners.
Is it a straight 1" drop for xr-xy's as i went 1" down and 1/8" back for my xm and have seen drilling templates for 67 and later mustangs on the net that just had the 1" drop.
 
#12 ·
that sounds like a plan. thanks for the writup... it was most informative, and i think that and a rack and pinion steering system may see me through

do you think RTA would have issues with this mod? cause my falc will need to pass roadworthy to get re registered.

any source on the Heavy duty ball joints mentioned in the article... i remember mum's stock XD having a ball joint let go and it wasn't pretty.

also what about bottoming out, do you mover your bump stops up, or put up with bottoming out.

also if up to XF's had the same front end, what do AU's and that havE?
 
#13 ·
Funny enough
I am also intersted in the legalitys of this and the rack conversion. so the infomation is USE AT OWN RISK but considering there must be thousands
of 60's mustangs out there with this done and the fact Carol shelby did this to the mustangs he designed i can't see any safety issue if the modification is done correctly. But i suspect they would want an engineers certificate if you explained it to them. even though your still using the same parts some clarafication would be good as i could be criminal doing all of these illegal mods to my car .i have never had to re licence a car over here ,do they check suspension geometry as the only sign of this mod.is the holes where the UCA's were and you need to take the wheels off to see the wedges.
You will need to find a wheel alignment shop thats knows what there doing and willing to set the alignment to something other than whats in there books for that model of car.
most auto shops not all will order the H/D ball joints for you, most of the time they just offer you the ones they have on the shelf which are usually the cheaper budget ones, they can be serviced by dismantled/cleaned and repacked with new grease.the ends of the slot can be cleaned up little if binding is a concern.
I set the suspension up with the shock spring sway bar and the rubber ball joint boots removed and used a trolley jack as in the Joes falcon link to move the suspension up and down just to asure myself the ball joint was not going to bind in the slot and snap off one day.
The Bump stops on my falcon are in there original postion with no problems at the moment, if i lower it another 10-20mm it might be.
Bump stop clearance affects all lowered falcons if they have the UCA drop or not , New springs that give you the ride height and spring rate for
how much suspension bump you want or have to play with on falcons and is the only way to lessen how often the bump stops get used.
ea onwards still use long/short arm suspension but unfortunatly dont share any parts with the earlier models
Does anybody know the spring rate of std XB gt springs as i need a base line to work with when selecting some new springs
 
#14 ·
I have also done the "SHELBY" mod to the upper control arms on my XK wagon (4 sale) and it now steers like a go-kart UNBELIEVABLE for those of you thinking about it DO IT you wont b disapointed
 
#21 ·
russxr67 said:
I think i,ll pass on that one. Did you check out the price? 239.95 US. Yeah, right! I may have to make my own.
US$239.95 isn't that bad when you take in the fact that Pro-Motorsports provides you with online and over the phone support. The guys are big time gearheads and have many years of racing under their belts. I've had a hard time stumping them with questions. I've got all their parts awaiting me to get some time to install them. BTW, if you buy their parts in kit form, like the wedge kit with springs, they will cut you a deal. Oh and their kit allows you to lower the upper control arm a little bit further down than the Shelby mod.

--J
 
#22 ·
XAFALCONGS said:
US$239.95 isn't that bad when you take in the fact that Pro-Motorsports provides you with online and over the phone support. The guys are big time gearheads and have many years of racing under their belts. I've had a hard time stumping them with questions. I've got all their parts awaiting me to get some time to install them. BTW, if you buy their parts in kit form, like the wedge kit with springs, they will cut you a deal. Oh and their kit allows you to lower the upper control arm a little bit further down than the Shelby mod.

--J
That equates to 330 aussie dollars. Are you suggesting thats good value? For two ball joints and the negative wedges and a bunch of bolts and nuts.I,d say its a rip off regardless of their online or telephone support.! I mean it,s not exactly rocket science is it.
 
#23 ·
Sorry guys, having trouble finding the CD that I archived the drawing on.... will post it as soon as I find it and convert it to something normal peoples pcs can read (ie not cad!)

One thing to consider when you look at prices for a piece like the wedge kit, is the Liability insurance that is so necessary to protect companies in the USA.... ie some doofus screws up an install (in the effort to create something that is fool proof, never underestimate the ingenuity of fools!) and then wipes himself, his car and some hapless bystander out, the doofus will probably try to sue the manufacturer of the components... hence the liability insurance...
However, the market for camber wedges in Oz would be sufficiently small that it would probably not be worth manufacturing the damn things here... i was going to get a couple of sets laser cut from thick plate and milled, but saw a neater way of doing it (oh, and i changed cars so i don't have 4 bolt ones anymore)....

I think its hillarious that everyone is raving about the RRS strut system, when struts are only magginly better than a swing axle for a car intended to handle... V8 supers let the Crummydores run the same wishbone front end as the fords so they can go round corners aswell.... if struts were so good, why aren't the Holden teams running them? There is alot that can be done to make the X series wiishbone front end much better... replace the lower inner bushing with a spherical to eliminate bind, replace the castor control bushes with a rod end (makes a biiiig difference!) ,replace the spring sadle bushes with roller bearings... this removes all the sources of bind in the front end, and with tweaked geometry (upper wishbone drop) the front end will work *very* well.

Ben
 
#25 ·
Those RRS conversions still use the bodgy stock lower arms. The WEAKEST part of the front suspension. How many camber pins and inner bushes have YOU replaced over the years?
 
#26 ·
xcgxl said:
Those RRS conversions still use the bodgy stock lower arms. The WEAKEST part of the front suspension. How many camber pins and inner bushes have YOU replaced over the years?
Some companies make better camber pins than others. I have examples of the two types here. One will round very easy. They other has no chance of rounding as there's more material. Factory ones are just pathetic.

Brenden
 
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