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Old 12-12-2004, 21:48   #1 (permalink)
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Location: Can hear Calder Park Raceway
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Question AOD conversion to Clevo/Windsor

Hi all!
I'm researching options for my latest project=XC ute.

I currently have- 351 Cleveland / FMX and 3 X Borgie diffs.
1) 3.23:1 single wheeler drum brake,
2) 2.75:1 LSD disk brake, and
3) 2.92:1 ??? dick brake.

All components WILL be rebuilt for cruising and HWY miles (AOD!)
and will be running an Impco 425 straight gas set up with cam etc.

I have two major queries 1) has anyone done th AOD conversion
and what did you do?
2) Re-Diff, what can I build out of the
the three that will best suit my needs?

Note- all work (rebuild) will be done by professionals and I will install.

Any advice/suggestions/leads would be great!!

Looking foward to your responses.
Thanks again, WILL.
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Old 12-20-2004, 02:15   #2 (permalink)
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Re: AOD conversion to Clevo/Windsor

I ran an AOD behind a 351C in an XA. Great gearbox. Same length as a C4 gearbox so even the driveshaft fitted perfectly. The only art is setting the TV linkage correctly. Get it wrong and goodbye transmission. Run 2 block plates between the engine and trans as the flex plate offset must be different between the 5.0L and 351C. I found out when I removed and sold the trans. The pumpbolts had rubbed on the converter ever so slightly. These things aside, the swap is really easy. Gearbox mounts, speedo drive gears, gear selector patterns are all identcal to C4.

Good luck.
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Old 12-20-2004, 20:50   #3 (permalink)
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Thumbs up Re: AOD conversion to Clevo/Windsor

Hi XAFalcon,
thanks for the reply and great to hear the conversion isn't as
hard as I thought. What sort of RPM were you cruising at 100kph
and what diff ratio did you have? Did you use the same flexplate
as the C4? Sorry about all the questions but not many clevo's with
4 speed autos about.
Anyway, have agreat Xmas and keep motoring!
Will.
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Old 12-21-2004, 00:45   #4 (permalink)
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Re: AOD conversion to Clevo/Windsor

with those 3 diffs the best combo would be the 3.23 in the 2.92 housing. The 2.77LSD runs a unique hemisphere and is unsuitable for the 2.92 and 3.23 gears (without custom spacers etc)

Whack the 3.23 gears in the 2.92 housing using the disc breaks. 3.23 is by no means to low if your using an AOD, and should see prm @ 100 arround 1900.
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Old 12-21-2004, 01:17   #5 (permalink)
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Re: AOD conversion to Clevo/Windsor

in USA they trick them up they are like an FMX with an overdrive
i did this conversion also to my 351 clevo. and would never do it again!
i'll tell you why, it bolted up using all mounts etc(i didn't use 2 sandwich plates never had probs here) mounts and speedo stuff is same, tv rod(like a kickdown lever on C10 box )was a pain to set up, but got it working perfect after a few mods to lever(made adjustable hole positions)(it will either change gears too soon or hold them too long if not correct)
right heres whaT i don't like about them they take ages to come out of overdrive first gear is tall and so is forfth, i had first left 2.92 diff in and found the clevo did not like pulling along at 1700rpm went too 3.23 not much better so went to 3.45 about 2000rpm at 100kmh clevo liked it but was no better on fuel as it was only doing 2300 with C10
with the 3.45 my gas gam which peaked at 4000rpm was not ideal so didn't gain any performance
the shifter i did have trouble with as it had a different lever position from memory. still had same amound of positions P N OD D LO

anyway with my experience it was no better for performance or economy and was agricultural in its shifts, i much prefer a C10 auto personally
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Old 12-21-2004, 22:03   #6 (permalink)
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Re: AOD conversion to Clevo/Windsor

Thanks guys.
Walkinshaw, my preference is for the 3.23 but I'm greedy and want both
LSD and disks. Is is possible to create this type of rear end with what I
already have using shims,etc?(and built by a diff shop)
I've never tackled a diff before and dont want to end up at the shop with
3 empty housings and and boxes of bits.
Deankdx, I'm getting similar info about the AOD from research on the net.
I'm becoming aware of this tranny's failings but have been made informed that
later (1996+) variants, yes, the electronically controlled ones are far superior
in strength and have better ratios in 1st and 2nd gears.
I've been reading heaps at www.baumannengineering.com, these guys
predominantly work with ford stuff. REALLY worth a look!
Have also found brand new trannies in your town, Corio Auto Spares
for $2150 inc GST for the 6 and 8 cylinder. These guys have great NOS stuff
and cheap!
I'd be keen to hear more of your experience as I too will be running straight gas.
Thanks again.
Will.
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Old 12-21-2004, 22:49   #7 (permalink)
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Re: AOD conversion to Clevo/Windsor

I've got to disagree with deankdx. For a start, they are a C4 with an OD. Nothing like an FMX. TV linkage does not control shift RPM, it controls line pressure and hence shift firmness. Get this wrong and your clutches slip excessively and the transmission wears out really fast. Gear ratios are 2.84, 1.42, 1, 0.67, just like a 3 speed with an overdrive. You will note the shifter gear positions listed above - P,R,N,OD,D,LO. If you were concerned about the time taken to get out of OD, you would just select D. After all OD is a crusing gear only. The AOD I used came from a 302W, so it naturally had a nice high stall effect behind a warm 351 cleveland. I could not stop the wheels from spinning with my foot on the gas pedal by pressing the brake pedal at hard as I could. I ran a 2.92 LS BW diff, and my cruise RPM @ 100 was aroung 16-1700 rpm.

The only thing I disliked about the AOD was the shifter shuffle required to manually control gear changes when driving it hard. Put it in LO until a gear shift was needed, move it to D until it changes, shift it back to LO to hold second, shift it to D to get third. Once you get used to it, it was no problem.

The proof of this conversion came when I raced my friends camaro. He runs a warm 400SB + TH350. I beat him off the line with ease, and held the gap through till 120mph when we buttoned off. I used all 4 gears.

Baumann is good, Lentech is the best for AOD stuff.
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Old 12-21-2004, 23:44   #8 (permalink)
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Re: AOD conversion to Clevo/Windsor

Quote:
Originally Posted by xafalcon
I've got to disagree with deankdx. For a start, they are a C4 with an OD. Nothing like an FMX. TV linkage does not control shift RPM, it controls line pressure and hence shift firmness. Get this wrong and your clutches slip excessively and the transmission wears out really fast..
unless i was told the wrong name for the box i bought? i was told it was an AOD i set up the TV rod myself and it definately affects how soon it changes gears mine was in 3rd gear at 10kmh when i tried to drive without it as you can do with a C10. i'm pretty sure mine came off a 302w and my stall was the same as a C10. personally i regret taking out the 4speed single rail
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Old 12-22-2004, 20:19   #9 (permalink)
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Re: AOD conversion to Clevo/Windsor

Duz this mean you can use C4 clutches, friction plates, stall's to hot them up.
When I had a look at some yank sites the prices were out there. $1500US for a stall converter, $3500US for a street-strip box ect. I didn't bother looking at them after that, but if C4 parts interchange then there might be hope yet. Living in the country an OD box would be sweet. Has lentech got a web site?
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Old 12-24-2004, 12:09   #10 (permalink)
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Re: AOD conversion to Clevo/Windsor

No, C4 parts don't interchange. Basic overhaul kits are similarly priced to C4/C6 overhaul kits. B&M converters in the current Summit racing catalog start at US$156.95 for a tork master 2000. High quality converters US$600. Expect to pay US$2000 for a built street/strip AOD. Do the maths @ current exchange rates (about US$0.77/AU$1.00) US$2600 = AU$3300. This gets you a 400HP guaranteed trans plus an excellent converter. The cost would be a loy less if you buy locally and do the overhaul yourself. But then you won't get the same experience Lentech put into each AOD they build.

http://www.lentechautomatics.com
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