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Old 09-18-2002, 03:08   #1 (permalink)
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BA Gearboxes - why no 6 speed?

I've been looking at the specs sheets for the BA and have noticed that 1st gear has been lowered across the range. This is probably not a bad thing as the vehicles are a tad heavier than the AUs.

However I've also noticed the 5th gear ratio for the V8 manual box (Tremec TR3650) is ridiculously high at 0.68. This is virtually the same as my TE50s at 0.62.

I understand Ford's position on not using a 6 speed box - they say a good 5 speed will easily cope with the torque range of the engine. I agree.

But not this 5 speed. It has the same spread of ratios from lowest gear to highest as a 6 speed box. Obviously then, this has to leave a large gap between gears somewhere and with this box it is between 4th and 5th. The % step up from 4th to 5th is greater than the % step up from 1st to 2nd. What type of engineer dreamed up this arrangement? I'm not an engineer but I do know this: with each successive upward gear change the % step up should decrease ie each gear becomes closer to the one before it. THAT IS BASIC!

Why oh WHY won't Ford use the T56 from the Mustang? It can be done. Easily. Rob Herrod's car is just one that all on this forum have heard of.

And before everyone jumps up and down shouting Holden box - IT IS NOT. The internals are entirely different with completely different gearset. And the ratios are almost perfect for this engine - it offers virtually the same spread of ratios (1st to 6th) that the Tremec offers (1st to 5th). The gap in the Tremec between 4th and 5th is split nearly perfectly in the T56.

Here are the gear ratios:

Tremec / T56

3.37 / 2.97
2.00 / 2.07
1.32 / 1.43
1.00 / 1.00
0.68 / 0.8
----- / 0.62

Answer? Geoff? David? Anyone at Ford?
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Old 09-18-2002, 04:26   #2 (permalink)
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I think the Ford engineers know what they are doing, but then again.
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Old 09-18-2002, 04:33   #3 (permalink)
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Hmm. Why, and I will ask again, why not use the 6 speed tremec from the Hiller 2 door concept?
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Old 09-18-2002, 04:37   #4 (permalink)
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Well they may know what they are doing with some things but I have tried to demonstrate here that there are serious questions over the "engineering" of the gearbox that Ford are going to use behind the new V8s. I would just hate to see such a great car and engine spoilt and I'm afraid that this is just about to happen.

Further to my concerns expressed in the first post I am also concerned with the noises associated with the Tremec TR3650 box. The experience I have had with mine is nothing short of disgraceful and Ford will seriously need to improve the product if BA V8 manuals are going to be accepted. I, for one, do not want to see the GT (after all the time we've waited) make it's comeback with a design flaw right from the start.
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Old 09-18-2002, 04:43   #5 (permalink)
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So you think FPV will get a different box? I'm sure there are great 6 speeders and IMO they should get some. it's even dissapointing that the boxes are at thier limit so moddign the engine might rquire a new box.
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Old 09-18-2002, 04:51   #6 (permalink)
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Red face re: gearbox

Remember...............there are prices you pay for high output engine performance......my best mate has a Venom red TE-50 T3 and his box is very clunky when cold but improves vastly once it has warmed up a little. The box kinda reminds me of a very sutle Toploader 4 speed......but i'd rather have a tough gearbox in the drive line than a wimpy one that might break. Besides...The T3 is an awesome car to drive......

P.S Tremec 6 speed is rumoured for the GT.
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Old 09-18-2002, 04:52   #7 (permalink)
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Well the T5 is definitely at it's limit behind the XR6-T ... and anyone who thinks they will up the boost and get 300kw will soon find that out.

The T5 does however offer good ratios, and although some exhibit a bit of noise, it is not as chronic as in the TR3650.

It's a pity the T5 can't be beefed up but it just doesn't have the physical capacity for bigger internals.
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Old 09-18-2002, 04:53   #8 (permalink)
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If Ford dont put a 6 speed in the FPV cars then theres somethin' wrong with them.
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Old 09-18-2002, 05:01   #9 (permalink)
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re: t3 man

Do you find 1st gear way too low.....my mate does have a whinge about that because all it does is wheel spin......I have driven his car quite a bit and god i get it sideways....in 2nd gear....good fun to drive.

oops...forgot to add......he just spent 3 grand on a new twin 3 inch system built by Liverpool Exhaust and hell....sounds just like a touring car.
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Old 09-18-2002, 05:43   #10 (permalink)
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according to the mags 6 speeds should arrive in time for BAII
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