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Old 06-14-2004, 08:23   #1 (permalink)
351 XE on LPG
 
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C4 not sliding all the way into the converter

I did a manual shift from first to second, (not drag racing, but not taking it real easy either), and there was a big bang when second should have engaged. Then I had nothing, forward or reverse. No visible damage on the outside, just a loud whining sound when idling.

What do you think has broken ?

My son and I have pulled the busted C4 out and am trying to slide my spare one on, but we always end up with a centimetre gap between the bell housing and the block. I presume the 2 faced edges on the outside of the converter are not lining up with the inside of the C4, so we rotated the motor by hand (a real pain with a high compression 351C), but still no good. It was so easy when the motor and trans was out of the car.

What are we doing wrong ?

Regards Rhett (and Blake)
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Old 06-14-2004, 18:52   #2 (permalink)
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Re: C4 not sliding all the way into the converter

Always install the convertor in the auto prior to mating it with the engine. The convertor should be able to slide back and forth once the engine and box have been mated, when the convertor bolts aren't done up.

When installing a convertor it should drop down twice. If it doesn't and you try and mate it with the engine. You'll break the front pump in the auto.

As much as it sounds to be a pain it's better to do box and engine all in one hit. Much easier!

Whats the oil look like? Full of metal or clutch material?

I am on a steep learning curve with C4. I'm on my 5th in 3 years.

Brenden
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Old 06-14-2004, 22:32   #3 (permalink)
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Re: C4 not sliding all the way into the converter

Thanks for your assistance Brenx.

Other times I have pulled both the box and motor as one assembly, but thought I'd have a go at just the auto to save some time. Obviously it hasn't saved me any time. I'm also going thru quite a steep learning curve.

The fluid is a dark, rich red. I cant see any obvious signs of foreign material. I'll bought more Type 3 fluid to replace the old.

So it looks like I'll need to remove the converter, slide it onto the auto, then mount the entire assembly to the motor. I may take this opportunity to swap my 3000 hi-stall back for the stock donut, then replace the hi-stall when I get around to changing my diff ratio.

Regards Rhett.
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Old 06-15-2004, 00:03   #4 (permalink)
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Re: C4 not sliding all the way into the converter

Sounds like you've not damaged a band or clutches. Maybe it's had pump or piston failure?

Brenden
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Old 06-15-2004, 00:03   #5 (permalink)
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Re: C4 not sliding all the way into the converter

I'd say you blew the planetary set apart in the C4, a fairly major physical failure and one of the C4's several weak points.

Also as Brenx said you definately need to slide the convertor back to the 2nd position (it's actually the 3rd position) deeper on the splines. Do this by rotating it around in various positions until it falls back in.

Putting a motor in separate to a C4 is not hard - just make sure that you do the torque convertor properly and you will be OK.
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Old 06-15-2004, 03:57   #6 (permalink)
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Re: C4 not sliding all the way into the converter

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rhett
I may take this opportunity to swap my 3000 hi-stall back for the stock donut, then replace the hi-stall when I get around to changing my diff ratio.

Regards .
Rhett Don't use the high stall if you were running it with the auto that blew. If metal got into the oil it will be in the convertor. It will need to be cut open to clean it properly. Also flush lines and trans cooler extra well, any metal left in there will damage the replacement auto in no time.

Ask me how I know!!
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Old 06-17-2004, 18:55   #7 (permalink)
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Re: C4 not sliding all the way into the converter

The hi-stall had a drain plug, so I've emptied as much as possible. The fluid looks a little darker then normal. I ran a magnet thru it and picked up a worrying amount of metal filings. I'll have to have it professionally cleaned.

I also placed a couple of magnets on the outside of the pan to hopefully trap any particles that may still be in my cooler lines. I may place another magnet on the cooler as well.

I placed my old stock converter on the C4 and it was soooo much easier then when the converter was still attached to the flex plate. Thanks for the tips guys. I ended up purchasing a large trolly jack which also made the installation possible.

The XE runs fine now. The difference between a stock converter and a hi-stall is incredible. I realise now just how much slippage there was. I'm soue I'll be getting much better economy now too. I idle around town at 60kmh with the 2.77s
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