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Old 04-25-2005, 03:45   #1 (permalink)
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XE 4.1 4speed, what box, how tuff?

As the title says. The car is an 84 S-pac wagon, EFI 4.1 to 4 speed.

What is this gearbox likely to be (is this what people call a single rail? why?)

How strong are they? Can I put a mild 351 (300hp flywheel) without shagging it in half a day.

Cheers
Phil
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Old 04-25-2005, 06:23   #2 (permalink)
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Re: XE 4.1 4speed, what box, how tuff?

If it is the original 4-Speed Gearbox for your car,then it is a 'Single Rail'.They are called this because they have a Single Shift Rail that runs along the Rear Extension Housing of the Box for Gear changing.They are reasonably strong and they were fitted to Late XB GT's and Manual XC 302/351 Cobras amongst other applications.If you convert your Car to V8 You will have to convert it to Hydraulic Clutch if you use Australian Parts,as I believe XE Manuals run a Cable Type Clutch set-up from memory? You will also need a Manual Ford Cleveland type V8 Bell-Housing,Clutch Fork and Thrust-Bearing,Clutch and Pressure Plate,Sandwich Plate,Fly-Wheel and Starter Motor.Your Gearbox will bolt straight up to the correct V8 Bell-Housing though,though you may need to adjust your Gearbox Cross-Member Position on the Rails? and if you do,then you should also re-check you Tailshaft Length to make sure it is still correct.It is best you use an Aussie Bell-Housing as they have the provisions for the Hydraulic Clutch Slave Cylinder to bolt to.American Ford Cleveland V8 Bell Housings and Canadian Ford 240/300 Cubic Inch Truck 6 Cylinder engines have the same Bell-Housings,but with no provisions for the Hydraulic Clutch Slave Cylinder to Bolt to.Aussie Single Rail and Top-Loader Bell Housings are also differant to each other and if you get a Top-Loader V8 Bell Housing for your Single Rail,then only one of the four Gearbox Bolt Holes will line up and you'll have to get the other three Holes Drilled and Tapped,but other than that they are basically identical.Also...before you get a Flywheel,you should work out what kind of Clutch you are going to use as not all of them are Multi-Drilled,So if you for one example buy an 11 Inch Clutch and Pressure Plate and your Flywheel is not Drilled for it...then you will have to get it Professionally Drilled and Tapped and possibly balanced to your Clutch and Pressure Plate.The V8 Clutch and Pressure Plate will also go straight onto your 6 Cylinder Gearbox Input Shaft.You should be able to still use your Cable Accelorator Pedal assembly,but will probably need to make up a new Bracket and get a differant Return Spring for the Accelorator Cable where it meets the Carburettor on your 351,unless you can find original Parts.I also believe that you have to fit a Spiggot Bearing to the rear of the Crankshaft if you get a 351 and use a Manual behind it? A Single Rail will be fine behind a 351 if you don't absoloutely cane it hard all of the time and the Shifters in them also don't like to much of a hard time as if you wear out the Nylon Bush that screws the Shifter into position...the Shifter can just pop out in your hand during mid gear change...I've seen it happen many times and it's very funny when it's someone elses Car,and your in it with them when it happens !!! I don't know if XD/XE V8's used the same Engine to Body V8 Mounting Plates as XA/B/C ? I don't know if your 6 Cylinder Radiator can be used with a V8? and there will be a few other issues you will have to sort out such as wiring and Emissions.I also recommend you use an XD/XE 351 Cleveland 'Black Motor' that use an Eloctronic Ignition as Standard with a built in Modulator or whatever they are called on the Distributor instead of a separate one like on XC.A Black Motor will also likely already have the correct Carburettor/Inlet manifold and Emission Fitting's to properly convert your Car to V8 if you are going to do a complete fully Legal and Approved Conversion.You also cannot properly fit a Distributor from a 351 Cleveland Black Motor to an earlier Blue Motor without Distributor Shaft Modification and vise-versa...Goodluck !!!
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Old 04-25-2005, 18:39   #3 (permalink)
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Re: XE 4.1 4speed, what box, how tuff?

i've got a 4-spd XF and its a borg warner 0506 model (single rail) and it does use a cable clutch. the shifters do break too :O but i just made a metal plate with a hole in the middle and wired the shifter to the gearbox. its stronger than ever now.
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Old 04-25-2005, 21:22   #4 (permalink)
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Re: XE 4.1 4speed, what box, how tuff?

Awesome data there guys, my gosh, I dont know if its worth all the trouble now. Probably take me 5 years to find all the parts.

If I can use the cable clutch. What parts would that eliminate from the shopping list?

The 351 is currently in an XD with a c4 and it is electronic ignition, I found this out when the ignitor died last year.
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Old 04-26-2005, 00:18   #5 (permalink)
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Question Re: XE 4.1 4speed, what box, how tuff?

Sorry, what I should have not assumed.

Slabz, have you fitted a V8 to your XF and use a cable clutch? or is factory 6 and always had a cable clutch?
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Old 04-26-2005, 00:33   #6 (permalink)
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confused Re: XE 4.1 4speed, what box, how tuff?

Cheers for that massive but cruicial run down on parts and instructions lukeh. It may nearly swing me to stick with the efi motor and look at turbo instead.

Kinda sad, would liked to have just popped the clevo into the wagon and tootled off. The XD thats currently keeping the weather off the clevo has only got a 6 cyl radiator and is fine in New Zealand climate. Even the fan on the crank went long ago in place of a pair of hidiously unreliable Merc electric fans that barely need to go on with the exception of a traffic jam or idleing for maintenance.

I was annoyed today to find out the LSD in the wagon isn't.....bugger.
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Old 04-26-2005, 00:36   #7 (permalink)
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Red face Re: XE 4.1 4speed, what box, how tuff?

Fan on waterpump.....duh! Now I look like a complete twat.
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Old 04-26-2005, 03:29   #8 (permalink)
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Re: XE 4.1 4speed, what box, how tuff?

If you already have the Cleveland,then you may aswell do what you have to and fit it...why not?? Properly fitting a Turbo is still fairly involved aswell anyway and by the time you get it to run right and everything,you will have spent a fair bit of cash also !!!
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Old 04-26-2005, 13:30   #9 (permalink)
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Re: XE 4.1 4speed, what box, how tuff?

Its probably what I actually want at the end of the day to. With the amount I've spent on the cleve what with unleaded heads and new every other bolt on part....what good would it be sitting in a shed.

If the bits are to hard to find in Christchurch, I may even auto the wagon. Not really what I want, but neither is a I6 I suppose........still annoyed the LSD isn't.

Cheers guys
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Old 04-27-2005, 17:41   #10 (permalink)
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Re: XE 4.1 4speed, what box, how tuff?

Quote:
Originally Posted by xentrix
Sorry, what I should have not assumed.

Slabz, have you fitted a V8 to your XF and use a cable clutch? or is factory 6 and always had a cable clutch?
yeah mine is a factory 6 with a huge 70.2rwkw

i wanna stick a v8 in my XF because we have a spare 302 clevland lying around here at home but i still have to contact Regency Park (im in SA) and find out if they will let me. money is the other issue, im a pov bastard uni student. my other plan is to get an XD or XE (prolly a grandpa one) thats auto and a 6 then stick the V8 in that (because it'll be legal just to chuck it str8 in) and stick a T5 behind it. until such a time i'm just going to waste money on my XF but only on things that i can stick onto my XD or XE when i get it like diff ratio, mini spool, rims, etc.

i've got a set of 3.7 diff gears lined up so behind my 4spd it should quite wheel spin stylez (and i'm foolishly hoping to start drifting (on the track) in the thing so watch out at Mallala for me)
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