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Old 10-17-2002, 03:36   #1 (permalink)
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Read Better bass hints needed

I own an 95 EF Falcon, just installed a Kicker Impulse 12 inch boxed sub and a decent 4 channel amp (although not competition quality lol), running from a decent Sony head deck. I'm finding that i do get a decent amount of bass, enough to make the car rattle where it shouldnt, to the point of making the rear vision mirror rattle (on glass mounts) and you can feel it thru the seats. Its not clear bass though, it isnt really punchy, it doesnt sound as clear as it should. And from outside the car, you can hardly hear it at all.

I've tried a number of things, turning the bass down on the head deck and turning up the gain on the amp, and vice versa. I've tried 180 degree phase shift, and changing the connections to the sub.

I've also tried changing the position of the amp in the boot too, i found the worst was against the back seat facing the car, the best somewhere in the middle of the boot (although thats entirely unpractical, facing into the boot against the back seat was nearly as good).

The amp leads are coming from the "rear output" line on the head deck, it has two outputs, labelled front and rear. As i Bias the stereo sound to the rear, the bass gets louder (as you'd expect). The leads go into the low input connections on the amp (the high input are for speaker leads if they need to go into it).

My only thought is that the sub, which i bought second hand from a friend, hasnt been used for a while, do they need time to become more flexible, or should they be good from the word go?

Any help would be appreciated, perhaps I need to accept its as good as its gonna get in that sized car with that amp. I am really chasing a punchier sound, rather than volume. Cheers...
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Old 10-17-2002, 03:56   #2 (permalink)
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I had a similar problem with my old crossfires, now ive upgraded to Fusion subs and installed a 1.5F capacitor and it pumps the bass crisply and cleanly. So I guess I cant really say if it was the subs or the cap that made the difference.
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Old 10-17-2002, 04:01   #3 (permalink)
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The sub is probably ****ed, time for a sub to work in is debatable, some people say its true some people say its a load of shit. Is the sub in a new box? Some people say a sub needs time to work into a new box

Try just turning the gain down on the amp, What configuration is the amp in? eg, bridged into 2 channels. Power ratings of both the amp and sub?

Is the box sealed or ported? If its ported block the hole with ur hand or something and see if u like the sound better.
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Old 10-17-2002, 04:07   #4 (permalink)
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The sub is in its original box, it isn't ported. The sub has hardly been used, its sat dormant in the back of a Holden for a year.

The amp has a subwoofer output and 2 channels for speakers, rated at 800W for the sub (obviously not RMS) and 300W for the speakers channels, which are also bridgable. I heard it run a 10 inch Sony sub at the place i bought it from, it seemed to run better than this, but was in a smaller car. Power rating of the sub I'm not sure, but I have heard the same sub run alot punchier....
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Old 10-17-2002, 04:51   #5 (permalink)
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Ur sub is probably up the shit then, even tho it hasnt been used it could have deteriated just by sitting in the car. Probably even more so cos it wasnt used much, not moving would lead to the cone and things hardening up and breaking once in full use again

Also check the voltage going to the amp, while the engine is running. If it's not around 12V that could be the problem. What sort of gauge power cable are using and also cable goin from the amp to the sub?
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Old 10-17-2002, 04:58   #6 (permalink)
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The power is fine, its a brand new heavy duty cable, i am 100% sure that isnt the problem, its about as think as my thumb, bit of an overkill, i reckon! The cable to the sub is also new thick cable as well, i dont beleive the problem to be there. I work on similar things in jet aircraft, so i am confident the cabling is ok.

One thing i did notice is that I am getting alot of treble out of just the sub, it seems to be amplifying everything, not just the bass. That tells me that perhaps the low pass filters are not working correctly.... either due to a fault or setup. Hard to tell for anyone trying to give advice without being able to see it and try different things!

The cone of the sub seems to be fine, it doesnt seem to have any problems with movement...... i think i'll throw the sub into a mates car and see how it goes, could at least eliminate one of the two parts....
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Old 10-17-2002, 19:02   #7 (permalink)
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Sounds like the crossovers are no set correctly. I'd suggest you have a low pass crossover on the sub, about 120Hz- and under.

Generally, you reduce the subs overhang by running it in a smaller enclosure. This should make the bass cleaner/tighter.
Also, you should be getting more punch when the sub faces forward, into the cabin.

If you have the time, try the thing in a smaller enclosure then the current one, say 0.25 to 0.5 cuft smaller, it might help you out.

Cyaaa
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Old 10-18-2002, 02:23   #8 (permalink)
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Bass Crazy - you are right...

Due to poorly written instructions with the amp, which advise to use the low imputs for subwoofer operation, it's been amplifying the whole sound thru the sub. So I tried going against the advice on the amp and plugged the low input into the subwoofer input, and hey, its a whole new sound. The bass is clear and punchy and loud, and no treble is coming through. It's like a whole new lease of life.

Why this was not recommended in the instructions in the first place is a mystery.... but ah well, the introduction of the low pass filters has done it worlds of good... the whole solution seems rather ridiculously easy in hindsight... subwoofer input for subwoofer use (even tho thats not what the instructions advise).... I might go buy a "Car audio for dummies" book now...(kidding) *hangs head in shame*

Thanks for all your help.... now I need to find a way to stop parts of the boot vibrating! But thats a happy problem! Cheers...
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Old 10-18-2002, 03:30   #9 (permalink)
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Fantastic!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Good to hear its all sorted.

As for the vibrations, mate, I have been putting of fixing this problem for the past 3 years because I didn't know where to start... I wish you luck.
This summer the car should be getting some major work in reguards to this issue... at long last.

Take care, and may the BASS BE WITH YOU!
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Old 10-23-2002, 04:28   #10 (permalink)
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I have a pair of dual voice coil type s 12's and a kenwood amp in my boot. when you put the back seats down the mirror vibrates down and yor looking at yourself, its ****in unreal

anyone got any ideas on how to stop it happening :o)
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