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Manifolds

3K views 31 replies 9 participants last post by  Soxx 
#1 ·
Is there any DYNO proven advantage from changing from the droopy ea/ed manifold to the ef manifold. Ive heard the ef ones are better for low end, but the Ea-EB ones are heaps better for top end pull.
I can get these manifolds easy as ,just woundering weather it would be woth the effort to change.
 
#2 ·
EF one for low end torque
ED one for top end power
 
#3 ·
sweet, so if you cam a motor up, which shifts it power range to top end, then the ED one is the one to stay with...

Is it true the ed ones have bigger runners than ea-eb
 
#9 ·
if running a cammed up motor wouldnt the EF/L manifold make more sense to get back some of the low end that you lose with the cam?
 
#10 ·
when building motors, i figure u carnt have it all.


With The 250 crossflow i built i used an ed manifold, cut down to shorten the runners, and welded to an xf injection manifold. With wild cam, over 260 @0.050 and 560 lift, low in the rev range it made nothing , but at 5500 made 300 hp (220 kw and at 430 nm at 3900. If i used a longer runner manifold, i wouldnt of gained that much power down low, and it would of killed the engines top end pull.

I figure u design cam/manifold/head to all work at the same rpm range, that way when u hit that range all hell breaks loose
 
#12 ·
"I figure u design cam/manifold/head to all work at the same rpm range, that way when u hit that range all hell breaks loose"

The problem is that if you arn't in that rev range your car will be a dog. I have approached my mods trying to achieve a compramise. I would love to be able to just on a dyno and blow everyone away, but if I did that with an I6 it would be a pain in the ass to drive everyday. The EF/El BBMs are one of these compramises. I loose a few KW up high so that I can jump of the line quicker. Having said that, with your diff I guess you dont spend much time below 3000 anyway!
 
#13 ·
good point, with higher gears you speend very little time under 3 grand, as evel with the cam wheel spin of the line is easy, so there isnt really a need for more low end pull mainly top end pull
 
#14 ·
When I converted my ED type manifold to the EF type manifold I made a pile of measurements and dyno runs.

Firstly, the manifolds are almost identical in length when in short runner mode. When in long runner mode, the runners are approx double in length.

Secondly, on the dyno, the difference is significant in the midrange, in the order of 40nm across a range from 2000rpm to 3500rpm.
Above 4500rpm, they are essentially the same, with the ED producing around 2kw more, which of course is insignificant compared to the 40nm gain at lower revs.

It's a no brainer, the BBM is a significantly better performing design, I'm not sure where the storys come from about the ED manifold being better for ultimate power, as this has yet to be proven.

Rick.
 
#16 ·
I noticed the difference in low end torque right away when I put the EL manifold on.

2kw top end....big whoop, like you spend much time there anyway.
 
#17 ·
what did you use to operate the butterflys in the manifold..... i have a few of the ef/el ones, what did u need other than air box, accelrator cable, and mabie the steel pipe
 
#18 ·
Steel pipe?

I'm running an EL ECU, doing all the switching for me.
 
#19 ·
where did u get the vacume for the manifold, the vlave requires a manifold vacume to switch it from long to short runner, by just fitting an el computer this wouldn do it... did the el ecu bolt right in , or was there a bit of messing around involved
 
#20 ·
Vacuum for the manifold? Errrr the manifold makes it's own vacuum. You just need to plug your vacuum lines into the EL vac tree.

Do you have EA, EB or ED? EL ECU will only plug straight into Smartlock fitted EB II and EDs.
 
#21 ·
nar man i mean the vlave that controls the 2 stage manifold.... hmm well that counts me out i have eb2 but no smart lock.. the steel water pipe, is different on the ed manifold, and on an el manifold, it would nearly run right into it
 
#22 ·
You can just bent the heater pipe.
 
#24 ·
There's a vacuum switch that operates an actuator.
 
#25 ·
so there would need to be extra wiring done and that pin traced back to the el computer to control this vacuum switch, as the wiring wouldnt be found in any car pre ef ???
 
#26 ·
INJECTED250 said:
So you would say its worth while ???
Absolutely definitely 100% worthwhile.
The difference it makes to the driveability is very good indeed.
what did u use to operate the manifold??
I initially used a rpm switch connected to a reverse relay which operated the VSV valve. This wasn't ideal as it operated the butterfly in the manifold, but didn't change the timing map. As a consequence, ignition timing was always a compromise.
I later changed to an EL ECU, and then a EL XR ECU.

Additional wiring needs to be run back to the ECU to operate the VSV, but that's a piece of piss.

Rick.
 
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