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Old 12-07-2003, 14:37   #1 (permalink)
docbrown
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confused EB I not starting when hot.

My EB series 1 with center point injection has a problem starting ONLY when it has been off for 1/2 an hour or so after being driven around on a hot day. It will eventually fire after 5 or ten mins of cranking.

It will start perfectly any other time and runs fine at all times when driving.
I have read all the posts regarding heat probs an EA/EB's eg tfi, coil, dizzy but im not convinced its one of these.

I have checked for spark at the plugs and all seems fine there. although, how do I know if the spark i'm getting is a good spark?

I have put a fuel pressure guage on with a tee piece at the inlet of the throttle body and all is good there but how can I check if both the injectors are fueling while cranking??

Thanks.

Last edited by docbrown; 12-07-2003 at 14:42.
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Old 12-07-2003, 15:44   #2 (permalink)
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Re: EB I not starting when hot.

Well if you want to see them fuelling, take the top of the air cleaner, and have someone have a look to watch for fuel, just be careful though, my brother was having trouble getting is V8 carby fed Holden to start, so I was helping watching for fuel goin going in, then a backfire and watching a ball of flame going for your head is an experience not to repeat :0) (p.s. I got out of the way no harm done)

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Old 12-08-2003, 04:28   #3 (permalink)
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Re: EB I not starting when hot.

Well from what I can tell the injectors are not fueling while cranking. I get a minor kick each time the key is turned but then nothing for the duration of cranking.

Any ideas on how the injectors get their info to fuel would be great.

Thanks
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Old 12-08-2003, 16:50   #4 (permalink)
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Re: EB I not starting when hot.

The fuel pump relay sounds like a problem, I believe it is under the Overflow tank or reserve tank if you like, and that would get very hot, i would replace that, will not cost much :0)

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Old 12-09-2003, 04:06   #5 (permalink)
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Re: EB I not starting when hot.

It is definetely a fuel problem. I put a few drops of petrol down the throttle body when while cranking and off she went, no problems and keeps running.

I have tested the fuel pump relay and it is fine.

I'm thinking its an injector problem. Either not getting enough voltage while cranking to fuel or maybe the injectors are seizing up when hot (does that make any sense)

Has anyone ever serviced their 2x CFI injectors? do they get clogged up?

Once again, any help would be great.

Last edited by docbrown; 12-09-2003 at 04:09.
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Old 12-10-2003, 03:09   #6 (permalink)
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Re: EB I not starting when hot.

if it only happens when your engine is hot on a hot day then you could have vapour lock in your fuel line. dont know if it happens to electric fuel pumps but it sounds like what happened to me when i tryed to start my dads XW on a hot day when the motor was hot, all i did was hold my foot flat to the floor and cranked it over then it started easily how ever it was a mechanical fuel pump. hope this helps anyway. PS hows Marty Mcfly... sorry had to do it.
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Old 12-10-2003, 06:07   #7 (permalink)
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Re: EB I not starting when hot.

docbrown, CFI injectors do cost a decent amount of $$$,
I would recommend picking up a second hand t/body, as you should be able to get one for next to nothing, and see if the problem still persists.

Another thing might be to see if it makes any difference in bringing the key back slightly when starting, as the barrel wears, sometimes when fully in the start position, the contacts go past the "on" position, and you lose power to the ecu and fuel pump.
Although its not really common on falcons, it does happen from time to time.

When the car has been sitting for 1/2 hour or so, and you turn the key to on only, can you hear the fuel pump prime for a second or two?

To tell if the spark is any good, get an old plug and open the gap up to around 1.2-1.4 mm and connect it to the longest lead (no 6.)
Start the car, and you should see a bright blue sharp spark, if it is orange, it may be too weak.
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Old 12-11-2003, 02:10   #8 (permalink)
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Re: EB I not starting when hot.

I can hear the fuel pump relay when the key is switch on when the car is hot, so i'd say thats ok. I'll give the key thing a go tomorrow and check the operation of the ecu relay. Its going to be hot so it will play up again... BTW John_xr6 Marty is fine :o)

Thanks to everyone so far. I'll get back..
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Old 12-17-2003, 03:46   #9 (permalink)
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Re: EB I not starting when hot.

Ok, so the key thing didn't work so now I'm thinking that maybe the fuel pump in the tank doesnt have enough guts while cranking.

The gregory's manual says that the pressure should be 100 kpa at idle and a maximum pressure of 175 kpa with the 'in' hose clamped.

My pump sits nicely at 100kpa at idle but only outputs a max of 120 kpa with the hose clamped. Does anyone know how accurate these figues are. Should I just buy another pump and hope its the problem???
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Old 12-17-2003, 17:11   #10 (permalink)
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Re: EB I not starting when hot.

docbrown,

before you go replacing the fuel pump, connect the pressure gauge directly to the fuel pump outlet (in the boot under the inspection cover)

If you still see the same low pressure, then remove the pump assembly and make sure the plastic union between the pump and the rest of the assembly - sometimes these come apart, and you will lose pressure from here, so replace it with a bit of efi hose and a couple of clamps.

Alternatively if that is not the problem, then you will be looking at another pump
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