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Old 12-12-2005, 07:42   #1 (permalink)
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Wink Cities Question Cost of Hybrid Cars

News 12/09/2005 08:40:39 EST

George Widman/AP Photo
Cities Question Cost of Hybrid Cars
By PATRICK WALTERS
Associated Press Writer
PHILADELPHIA - By gradually adding hybrids to this city's vehicle fleet, James Muller knows he's helping to save the environment. What he doesn't know is whether switching to the more expensive "green" vehicles will save taxpayers money.

The city just bought 20 new hybrid Ford Escapes to add to the six Toyota Priuses already in its 6,000-vehicle fleet. Muller, Philadelphia's fleet manager, said officials are doing it to improve air quality, but that the upfront costs definitely take a bigger hit on city coffers.

"That's what we're finding with the initial cost ... it doesn't wash out," he said. "You're actually paying more money."

Hybrid vehicles, which save gasoline by switching between an electric motor and a gas engine, are seeing enormous sales growth among ordinary consumers. More than 173,000 had been sold in 2005 through October, more than doubling the total for all of 2004, according to the Electric Drive Transportation Association.

Officials in many cities, however, are hesitant, even though municipal governments have been part of the vanguard for bringing technologies such as electric cars and natural-gas-powered buses to the nation's roads.

It's only been a year or two since many cities started adding hybrids to their fleets, but officials say the initial costs can be tough to bear. And they simply don't know whether they'll save money over gasoline-only or diesel vehicles the long run.

Officials in various cities estimate that choosing a hybrid vehicle costs an extra $3,000 to $8,000, depending on the model and which gasoline-only model would have been bought in its place.

Officials in Ann Arbor, Mich., decided not to add hybrids to their fleet after determining the costs would outweigh the benefits. Ann Arbor has other types of alternate-fuel vehicles, but found that hybrids just weren't cost-effective, said David Konkle, the city's energy coordinator.

Konkle estimated the hybrids would save $300 to $500 a year each in gas, making it impossible to make up the difference in purchase price, which he said was $8,000.

"Economic times have been very tough and we were facing the toughest budget year that I've seen in the 15-plus years that I've been here at the city," Konkle said.

In New York, which had bought more than 830 hybrids as of 2004, the vehicles make sense because the city now requires the purchase of the cleanest vehicle available, said Mark Simon, director of alternative fuel programs.

"It was not our mandate to save money," he said. "They're expecting us to pay more for a cleaner tailpipe."

In Oregon, Dan Clem oversees 3,000 vehicles - 123 of them hybrids - as fleet manager for the state's Department of Administration Services.

Whether the state ultimately saves money depends on a number of factors, including how gas prices change and how well the hybrids hold up, he said.

"If they don't last, then they won't pencil out," Clem said, adding that they appear to be holding up well so far.

Hybrids are a low-risk technology, but the price does cause some governments to think hard before buying them, said Brian Wynne, president of the Electric Drive Transportation Association.

"Yes, there is a premium associated with buying a hybrid vehicle at this point," said Wynne, whose group's members include vehicle and equipment manufacturers and energy suppliers. "I don't think there's hesitancy, I think there's diligence."

Wynne said prices will go down as production increases, and that government incentives such as tax credits will help defray the cost.

Bradley Berman, editor of hybridcars.com, a consumer-information site, said fleet managers need to look at how much they typically drive a vehicle and how long they keep it.

"Obviously, the more you drive the more you save and the more compelling the financial equation is," Berman said.

In Ann Arbor, which has faced layoffs, Konkle said the expense of hybrids was pretty much out of the question this year.

"Is this year a good year to demonstrate our greenness by buying a hybrid vehicle?" he said. "And the answer was, 'no.'"

____

On the Net:

Electric Drive Transportation Association: http://www.electricdrive.org/

Hybridcars.com: http://www.hybridcars.com

Center for Automotive Research: http://www.cargroup.org/

Original Article: http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2005/...8ECOIMO0.shtml
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Old 01-19-2006, 09:23   #2 (permalink)
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Re: Cities Question Cost of Hybrid Cars

I sell Fords and when I get a customer on a Escape Hybrid I always ask one question, Do you drive mostly in areas of 35mph and less or do you do a lot of driving at 45mph and above? Hybrids aer not effective unless you do an extreme amount of driving under 25mph.
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Old 01-31-2006, 11:42   #3 (permalink)
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cool Re: Cities Question Cost of Hybrid Cars

The Ford dealer where I get my cars and trucks has had the same Escape Hybrid on the lot since August. Tax credit or not, I think the $5000 to replace the battery pack in 4 years has people thinking twice. Would you buy a gas-powered rig knowing that in 4 years you'll have to replace the engine?
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