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Old 02-27-2010, 19:56   #1 (permalink)
gen1knockoff
 
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budget engine/trans combo.....specific please

OK. I wanna build a 92-96 short bed when i finish UTI....(gen1 lightning knockoff) I dont wanna spend over 5000-6000 total. I dont really wanna put more than 3000 into the engine. I got my heart set on the roller 351w but idk what i should do (on a budget) to the top end, ignition, fuel delivery. I wanna hit close to 400rwhp. I think i can use the stock crank if its in good shape. Do i need new pistons? If so...forged? I have no clue on the trans.....have to have a manual....somethin streetable obviously. Im open for ideas on other cool stuff to do to the truck sooo hit me!
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Old 03-02-2010, 08:18   #2 (permalink)
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Re: budget engine/trans combo.....specific please

You might want to do a LOT of research. It will cost at least $2000.00 just to do a stock rebuild on your engine. The 351W is not the best engine out there for what you want to do. You will NERVER get 400 H.P. at the back wheels with only a 3000.00 engine build. It cost me over $2100.00 to rebuild a 3.8 and i didn't bore it or put in new pistons.
If you want 400rwhp and the transmission,differential,and suspention to stay together you will need about $15,000.00 to $20,000.00. To get REAL 400rwhp it is usually 3 to 1.
1200 hp engine. 400 hp wheels. Approx. give or take. 400rwhp is NOT streetable.
I have a 428 super cobra jet with moderate modifications. Complete rotating mass and
carburetion and ignition.Still LOTS to do on it. Ran out of money. I'm into it for $12,000.00. Puts out 793.7 H.P. 297.02rwhp. This is normally asperated with a 780 double pumper. If i change transmissions i get about 400rwhp. The transmission i needed that stayed together cost me $2300.00 and the diff. cost me $1700.00. My $1400.00
transmission blew up. Just some info for you from someone that knows what your trying to do. It ain't happening on the money you have. I'll give you all the hints you need when you get started. Good luck.
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Old 03-02-2010, 12:56   #3 (permalink)
canuck
 
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Re: budget engine/trans combo.....specific please

If you want LOW cost, I hate to say this but look at getting a GM crate engine. They're a dime a dozen and I'm sure someone can hook you up with a bell housing to mate up with a transmission of your choice.

I had an old C1500 '90 rwd 5.0L. I swapped out the stock engine for an upgraded 5.7L V8 with 320hp at the crank, going through a NEW, upgraded GM 4 speed auto. I'd say it put down around 230-240hp at the wheels. Total cost (engine was on sale) was just under $7.5K. That was a GOOD PRICE, especially in Canadian dollars. If I wanted the 350hp engine, I'd have to tune the suspension and other components to handle the extra oomph, and I'd be well over five figures. So 320hp crate engine worked for me. I put on 62K in two years with it and sold it for good money, I didn't see any profit, but came close to breaking even since I paid $2500 for the truck at auction with NO rust.

I looked at getting a 408 stroker for my Dodge Durango as it's my work horse; trailer puller, trail rider, etc. Best price locally I can find with a rebuilt block was in the $6K range, including the stroker kit. That's not including the transmission upgrade which I would have to do, so add on another $3K. $9K for a STROKER. That's too much so I decided against it as I'll be literally throwing my money away. The current 360ci V8 still has plenty of life left in it anyway.

As for the build you want, you're best bet to stay within your budget is to keep an eye on salvage yards, and Ebay. Ebay is a good resource to check for this type of stuff. A lot of times people will list something without knowing its value, and you could get a $10K engine for $3-4K. I don't see it often, but they are out there. NV4500 is a good transmission all around, and parts are a plenty. I'm not sure of the torque capacity but finding one in decent shape will still cost you a pretty penny, but not as much if you were to buy new.

As for engine internals, I wouldn't worry about upgrading the pistons unless you plan to boost the engine, either supercharger, turbo or add NOS. Stock pistons in nearly every engine are well built to withstand additional power within a reasonable means. My Dodge 360 block can handle close to 500hp before internal modifications are necessary. It's one of the reasons I bought it over a newer Ford or GM SUV at the time.

You can get creative if you put your mind to it. Thirty years ago, import sports cars had plastic rear differentials (most were covers) to save on weight. If you can get an engine with decent HP at a low price, just concentrate on weight savings and you'll gain performance that way. It costs nothing to remove bits and pieces, but costs a ton to add some on.
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Old 03-02-2010, 15:12   #4 (permalink)
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Re: budget engine/trans combo.....specific please

360CI. Thanks for the memory jog. Forgot about the crate engine. Best idea and best
money for the buck. Plus you get a warranty. I'm getting old.
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Old 03-02-2010, 17:09   #5 (permalink)
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Re: budget engine/trans combo.....specific please

Quote:
Originally Posted by chipset View Post
360CI. Thanks for the memory jog. Forgot about the crate engine. Best idea and best
money for the buck. Plus you get a warranty. I'm getting old.
No. You're just gaining experience. That, never gets old.

The crate engine I bought was an excellent deal at the time, price, and a two year warranty with unlimited miles. I'll also add that GM is the strongest with crate engines. Hell, you can even 'build a crate' online. Still, some guys build engines solely for the profit, so it PAYS to shop around carefully and find what you need. Ebay is a great crate source to start looking.

351W can be had, but personally if you want HP, get a old built, 5.0L Mustang engine. Even a block can be had for under $1K (used with decent miles), and then you can add pistons, top end, etc from there at your own discretion. Be warned, going all out can still cost you upwards of $4K plus the block itself, not to mention install time, trial and error on fitment, engine mounting locations, etc.
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'00 Durango R/T 360ci 290hp (modded); 138,500m
'06 Pontiac G6 GT 3.5L 220hp; 44,000m
'12 Chrysler 200 Limited 3.6L 283hp; 13,000m
'99 Taurus 3.0L 2V Vulcan 145hp; 154,300m - Traded
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Old 03-02-2010, 20:40   #6 (permalink)
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Re: budget engine/trans combo.....specific please

im really lookin for somthin thatll "sit you in your seat" for cheap...would a 5.0 be cheaper to make power? throw some numbers at me please...i know someone on here has toyed with the 5.0
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Old 03-03-2010, 07:32   #7 (permalink)
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Re: budget engine/trans combo.....specific please

The very FIRST thing you have to do is know what engine you have. Everyone says
5 lt. 302. WRONG. The mustang has a 5 lt- 305. The real 302 is a 4.9. They are different.
There are 61 cubic inches to a liter X 5 = 305. Do the math. Internal parts are not inter
changable. Yes the mustang has a 5 lt. 305. That motor was made specially for that car.
The under hood decal on my truck says 5 lt. It is not. It's a 4.9 - 302. Returned my gasket set. Didn't fit.
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Old 03-03-2010, 12:10   #8 (permalink)
canuck
 
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Re: budget engine/trans combo.....specific please

Yeah, gotta watch the cubic inches.

I wouldn't go with a larger block than a 305 as it'll put out a decent power to weight ratio, even more so depending on how much you put into it.

My dad's hand-me-down car that I inherited was a '91 Mustang LX hatch with the "5.0" 302ci. It's actually 4949cc which is technically a 4.9L engine. Stock, it put out a modest 225hp and 300lb ft. If I had decided to build it I'm sure I could get it into the 250hp range without diving into the engine. Bolt on parts can do quite a bit with a good tune. The 302 V8 also has a bore of 4.00" and a stroke of "3.00". You'll find it's more common than the 305 of that era.

Don't expect to get a 302 and install it in your truck thinking that it'll put out 225hp, because it won't. Different exhaust and intake routing will more than likely lower HP. Weight will also hamper performance as I had mentioned earlier. Be sure to get a pre-1995 engine so you don't have to deal with the OBD emissions.
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'00 Durango R/T 360ci 290hp (modded); 138,500m
'06 Pontiac G6 GT 3.5L 220hp; 44,000m
'12 Chrysler 200 Limited 3.6L 283hp; 13,000m
'99 Taurus 3.0L 2V Vulcan 145hp; 154,300m - Traded
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Old 03-22-2010, 10:44   #9 (permalink)
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Re: budget engine/trans combo.....specific please

dude the 305 is still les then 5 litres as well its actually 4998 cc so technically niether is really a 5.0. a mustang motor is a ho motor though but that was also used in many other apps. like the eddie bauer trucks, my 94 has a 5.0 h.o. wich is ussually noticable by the mass air flow sensor. but as far as building a good performance blue oval motor , the 5.0 h.o. is probably the best base block(currently), & there is tons of add ons to get decent power gains, easest & chepest route is to do the small stuff to a stock motor, should be able to pick up a 5.0. from wrecker for reasonable price, (exhaust, intake, fuel system.) you can build a fairly stout truck for not a whole lot of money that would put a beatin on any camaros, or stangs
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