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"Cory Dunkle" <cdnews@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:JPadncsCaJn2WKXfRVn-gg@comcast.com...
> "pick one" <try again!> wrote in message
> news:s9SdnedyuJWEH6XfRVn-gA@comcast.com...
>>
>> "Cory Dunkle" <cdnews@comcast.net> wrote in message
>> news:C5Odnfu9xOE606XfRVn-rA@comcast.com...
>> >I remember now why I stopped reading and posting to this group. Too many
>> > smart-asses like you being rude. I think it's clear I've done a little
> more
>> > than just sit there tightening down on the rocker (can't tighten a
> lifter,
>> > except perhaps with a different spring, smart-ass).
>> >
>>
>> You can over tighten a lifter till the internal spring is collapsed, now
> it's a
>> solid lifter. Once a lifter is adjusted it should never need adjusting.
>
> Never say never... After 200,000 miles there may be enough wear to need a
> little adjusting (a common problem with late model 302s with high mileage,
> slight tick in the valvetrain as the rocker arms are the positive stop type
> and therefore not adjsutable). There is also the fact that the lock nuts
> used on these heads _will_ loosen over time. It's a fact and unavoidable.
> Using polylocks will prevent rockers backing off, or using two lock nuts
> (instead of one) will help. I've never heard of an engine that does not need
> the rockers adjusted periodically. 200,000 miles and I imagine any engine
> will make a little rocker noise unless adjusted. You do mention lfiters
> needing adjustment though (which lifters can not be adjusted, to my
> knowledge), so maybe you are referring to something else. I am assuming you
> are referring to adjusting the rocker arms.
>
300K on my 91 vic, never adjusted. It's non- adjustable. Engine never apart.
except for an intake gasket. That is only one example. Sorry kid, I've been
around a hell of a lot longer than you. Just by the way the lifter operates and
its design, no adjustment needed.
>> > In any case, while measuring the travel may be worthwhile, I don't
>> > understand how that may cause a ticking/tapping that would stop when
>> > applying pressure on the side of the valve. If the cam lobe were worn
> that
>> > should only result in less valve lift. Adjusting the rocker properly
> should
>> > ensure there is no noise as there is no slack anywhere from camshaft to
>> > valve. So, if you don't mind, I'm curious as to how a slightly worn cam
> lobe
>> > would make the rather loud noise my engien is making.
>> >
>> In side your type of lifter is a plunger held up by a spring. There are
> two oil
>> passage ways. there is also a check valve. The job of the lifter is to
> provide
>> oil supply to the rocker through the lifter, that is done with the
> plunger. This
>> is what happens. When the lifter is on the base of the cam lobe ( valve
> closed )
>> the oil passage on the side ( notice the hole is also in a grove ) of the
> lifter
>> is feed with oil from the oil pump ( the lifter is also a valve of
> sorts ). This
>> fills the space beneath the plunger. As the cam rotates and pushes the
> lifter up
>> it's bore the hole in the side of the lifter moves up ( duh ). Now the
> lifter
>> acts as a valve, the hole and grove is past the feed hole in the block, so
> the
>> oil passage is closed. The space beneath the plunger is now full. As the
> lifter
>> continues up it tries to push against the push rod which at this point the
> oil
>> pressure in the lifter combined with the spring over comes the pressure of
> the
>> valve spring. As the lifter gets towards the top of its travel the valve
> spring
>> is near it's fully compressed state, because of this spring pressure of
> the
>> valve over comes the oil pressure and spring pressure in the space below
> the
>> plunger moving the plunger down into the lifter. The oil pressure in side
> the
>> lifter raises up enough to open the check valve and that small amount of
> oil is
>> now forced into the push rod. As the cam rotates to the down slope of the
> lobe
>> the spring pressure from the valve pushes the lifter down into its bore.
> As the
>> valve closes the spring pressure becomes less than the spring pressure in
> side
>> the lifter, so now the plunger moves up in it's bore. Then the cycle
> starts over
>> again. Eventually the push rod gets full so any extra oil gets pushed out
> lubing
>> the rest of the valve train. That is why lifters always tick for a while
> when
>> new ones are installed and why there is always a delay for oil squirting
> out the
>> top of the push rod. That being said you can see why just tightening the
> valve
>> does nothing but cause more problems. You run the risk of collapsing the
> lifter,
>> that will starve the rest of the valve train of oil.
>
> I have taken the lifter apart, cleaned and inspected it. It appears to be in
> good condition. Regardless, your explanation of how a hydraulic lifter works
> does not explain how a worn cam lobe will cause excess noise.
>
>> > For what it's worth the motor only has 18,000 miles on it and was
> properly
>> > broken in, and looking down the head all rockers appear to have the same
>> > travel (I know that doesn't necessarily mean much, but I've seen engines
>> > with wiped cam lobes and it was obvious to me that those particular
> valves
>> > were not opening as far as the others).
>> >
>>
>> It only takes a few thousands to make lifter noise. Didnt you recently say
> you
>> over heated this engine by running it with no coolant? Thats all it takes
> to
>> destroy a lifter.
>
> No, that was a 289 I had a good while ago (this engine is a 302). This
> engine has been treated properly it's entire life. It is a year old and has
> 18,000 miles on it. The heads were used for a few thousand miles on a
> different engine and have not been 'abused' or neglected.
>
> At this point I'm thinking it's eitehr the valve spring/damper, or the valve
> guide. I don't see what else it could be that is causing this noise.
>
Then it's time to get out your measuring devices and check tolerances.
> Cory
>
>> > Cory
>> >
>> > "pick one" <try again!> wrote in message
>> > news:CNCdnSadv78ON6rfRVn-sA@comcast.com...
>> >>
>> >> Instead of constantly just tightening the lifter which does nothing but
>> > limit
>> >> its job why don't you measure the rocker travel. Do some real
> diagnosis.
>> > Install
>> >> a dial indicator on a good rocker and measure the travel while slowly
>> > turning
>> >> over the engine. Then do the same on the suspect rocker. Make sure that
> if
>> > the
>> >> suspect bad rocker or cam lobe is a intake you put the dial indicator
> on a
>> >> intake, if it is an exhaust, measure an exhaust. Your looking for the
> same
>> >> travel. That will tell you if the cam lobe is worn down. Hell even a
> cheap
>> >> Haynes manual talks about measuring cam lobe lift.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> "Cory Dunkle" <cdnews@comcast.net> wrote in message
>> >> news:u62dnbvXPvaoOKrfRVn-1w@comcast.com...
>> >> >I don't remember for sure, but I don't believe it does. I'll test that
> as
>> >> > you mention though, and see if the noise goes away for a second. It
>> > would be
>> >> > nice if it was something as cheap and easy as a bad lifter. I kinda
>> > doubt it
>> >> > though, as I don't imagine moving the rocker that little bit has much
>> > affect
>> >> > on the lifter. The noise goes away if I push hard on the side of the
>> > valve
>> >> > spring and retainer, not touching the rocker arm.
>> >> >
>> >> > Cory
>> >> >
>> >> > "tom" <tjctransport@optonline.net> wrote in message
>> >> > news:x1LZd.23166$W62.10875@fe09.lga...
>> >> >> when you go to zero plus 1/4, does the noise go away for a bit and
> then
>> >> > come
>> >> >> back?? if so, than you probably have a bad lifter
>> >> >> "Cory Dunkle" <cdnews@comcast.net> wrote in message
>> >> >> news:F_CdnTG1bJjKx6rfRVn-ow@comcast.com...
>> >> >> > Unfortunately that doesn't cure it. I've tried tightening it even
>> > more
>> >> >> > (slowly with engien running until it runs rough) and it doesn't do
>> > it.
>> >> > The
>> >> >> > heads don't have a whole lot of miles on them... I got them second
>> > hand
>> >> >> but
>> >> >> > they did not have many miles on them when I got them, and I've
> only
>> > put
>> >> >> > 18,000 miles on them. They should have less than 25,000 miles. All
>> > the
>> >> >> other
>> >> >> > rockers are quiet with adjusting to zero+1/4 turn.
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > I'm wondering if maybe the valve guide on that cylinder could be
>> >> > bad/worn
>> >> >> on
>> >> >> > that valve, maybe letting the valve rock a little in the guide.
> The
>> >> > noise
>> >> >> is
>> >> >> > a lower pitched noise than typical rocker noise. Don't know if
> that
>> >> > tells
>> >> >> > you anything though.
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > Cory
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > "tom" <tjctransport@optonline.net> wrote in message
>> >> >> > news:tRGZd.4201$iZ7.523@fe10.lga...
>> >> >> > > adjust your valves to zero lash, plus 1/4 turn. this should
>> > eliminate
>> >> >> your
>> >> >> > > problem
>> >> >> > > "Cory Dunkle" <cdnews@comcast.net> wrote in message
>> >> >> > > news:i6GdnYahrvGieavfRVn-og@comcast.com...
>> >> >> > > > I have a 302 ('86 block, 28oz imbalance) with '65 289 heads
>> > (round
>> >> >> > pushrod
>> >> >> > > > holes, rail rockers, 53.5cc chambers) it has a stockish
> hydraulic
>> >> > flat
>> >> >> > > > tappet cam.
>> >> >> > > >
>> >> >> > > > My #8 intake valve makes a ticking/tapping noise. It sounds a
> lot
>> >> > like
>> >> >> > > when
>> >> >> > > > a rocker arm is too loose, except perhaps a bit of a deeper
> tone.
>> >> > With
>> >> >> > the
>> >> >> > > > engine running and the valve cover off the noise is present.
> When
>> > I
>> >> >> push
>> >> >> > > the
>> >> >> > > > rocker arm (at the valve tip) toward the front of the motor,
> the
>> >> > noise
>> >> >> > > goes
>> >> >> > > > away and the motor doesn't make any noise. When I let go it
> will
>> >> > stay
>> >> >> > > silent
>> >> >> > > > for a few seconds, then start making the nosie again. If I
> push
>> > the
>> >> >> > rocker
>> >> >> > > > arm (at the valve tip) toward the back of the motor, it will
> also
>> >> > make
>> >> >> > the
>> >> >> > > > noise. The motor does not make this noise when cold (if it
> does,
>> > it
>> >> > is
>> >> >> > > very
>> >> >> > > > faint), only after running for 5-10 minutes to get up to
>> >> > temperature.
>> >> >> > > >
>> >> >> > > > This noise is not present when turning the motor over by hand.
> I
>> >> >> checked
>> >> >> > > for
>> >> >> > > > clearance issues between the rails on the rocker arm and the
>> >> > retainer,
>> >> >> > > there
>> >> >> > > > are none. I checekd to ensure the rocker arm slot is long
> enough
>> > and
>> >> >> is
>> >> >> > > not
>> >> >> > > > binding on the stud, it is not. There is no sign of abnormal w
> ear
>> > on
>> >> >> the
>> >> >> > > > valve tip or the rocker arm. The valve spring and damper
> appear
>> > to
>> >> > be
>> >> >> > > intact
>> >> >> > > > and not binding. The damper does not appear to be hanging or
>> > binding
>> >> >> on
>> >> >> > > the
>> >> >> > > > spring.
>> >> >> > > >
>> >> >> > > > If anyone has any thoughts on what this may be I'd appreciate
> it.
>> >> >> > > >
>> >> >> > > > Cory
>> >> >> > > >
>> >> >> > > >
>> >> >> > >
>> >> >> > >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >>
>> >> >>
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >>
>> >>
>> >
>> >
>>
>>
>
>
Cory,
Get your heads redone and\or (at least) install a new cam and lifters already.
There are lots of hypothetical failure scenarios, but....YOUR LIFTERS ARE WORN OUT.
I appreciate your love of your 67-68 Fords (My first car was a 68
XL\GT)(428\2x4\4-speed :)), but when all is said and done, they wear out after 37
years. No amount of throwing used parts at them will fix the problem.
Listen to Pick One instead of arguing with him, you might learn something.
Tom
"pick one" <try again!> wrote in message
news:lL2dnY1nxYN9R6XfRVn-sQ@comcast.com...
>
> "Cory Dunkle" <cdnews@comcast.net> wrote in message
> news:JPadncsCaJn2WKXfRVn-gg@comcast.com...
> > "pick one" <try again!> wrote in message
> > news:s9SdnedyuJWEH6XfRVn-gA@comcast.com...
> >>
> >> "Cory Dunkle" <cdnews@comcast.net> wrote in message
> >> news:C5Odnfu9xOE606XfRVn-rA@comcast.com...
> >> >I remember now why I stopped reading and posting to this group. Too
many
> >> > smart-asses like you being rude. I think it's clear I've done a
little
> > more
> >> > than just sit there tightening down on the rocker (can't tighten a
> > lifter,
> >> > except perhaps with a different spring, smart-ass).
> >> >
> >>
> >> You can over tighten a lifter till the internal spring is collapsed,
now
> > it's a
> >> solid lifter. Once a lifter is adjusted it should never need adjusting.
> >
> > Never say never... After 200,000 miles there may be enough wear to need
a
> > little adjusting (a common problem with late model 302s with high
mileage,
> > slight tick in the valvetrain as the rocker arms are the positive stop
type
> > and therefore not adjsutable). There is also the fact that the lock nuts
> > used on these heads _will_ loosen over time. It's a fact and
unavoidable.
> > Using polylocks will prevent rockers backing off, or using two lock nuts
> > (instead of one) will help. I've never heard of an engine that does not
need
> > the rockers adjusted periodically. 200,000 miles and I imagine any
engine
> > will make a little rocker noise unless adjusted. You do mention lfiters
> > needing adjustment though (which lifters can not be adjusted, to my
> > knowledge), so maybe you are referring to something else. I am assuming
you
> > are referring to adjusting the rocker arms.
> >
> 300K on my 91 vic, never adjusted. It's non- adjustable. Engine never
apart.
> except for an intake gasket. That is only one example. Sorry kid, I've
been
> around a hell of a lot longer than you. Just by the way the lifter
operates and
> its design, no adjustment needed.
Sorry kid, laws of physics and my experience both show that rocker arms will
need periodic adjustment, unless perhaps polylocks are used. Standard
locknuts will back off over time, especially if they have ever been removed
after initial installation. It's a fact, get used to it. In the mean time,
try learning some basic Usenet etiquette and trimming your quotes.
"Tom Adkins" <newton5@remove.comcast.net> wrote in message
news:3pWdneKOv6YlQaXfRVn-oQ@comcast.com...
>
> Cory,
> Get your heads redone and\or (at least) install a new cam and lifters
already.
> There are lots of hypothetical failure scenarios, but....YOUR LIFTERS
ARE WORN OUT.
>
> I appreciate your love of your 67-68 Fords (My first car was a 68
> XL\GT)(428\2x4\4-speed :)), but when all is said and done, they wear out
after 37
> years. No amount of throwing used parts at them will fix the problem.
>
> Listen to Pick One instead of arguing with him, you might learn
something.
> Tom
Lifters are 1 year old and have 18,000 miles on them. I was not aware a cam
and lifters only last 18,000 miles. The heads have less than 25,000 miles on
them. I was not aware heads only last 25,000 miles. If you read my posts in
this thread you would know that this is a low mileage motor that has been
cared for and not abused.
"Cory Dunkle" <cdnews@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:4bCdnftdFbc4nqTfRVn-ug@comcast.com...
> "Tom Adkins" <newton5@remove.comcast.net> wrote in message
> news:3pWdneKOv6YlQaXfRVn-oQ@comcast.com...
> >
> > Cory,
> > Get your heads redone and\or (at least) install a new cam and lifters
> already.
> > There are lots of hypothetical failure scenarios, but....YOUR LIFTERS
> ARE WORN OUT.
> >
> > I appreciate your love of your 67-68 Fords (My first car was a 68
> > XL\GT)(428\2x4\4-speed :)), but when all is said and done, they wear out
> after 37
> > years. No amount of throwing used parts at them will fix the problem.
> >
> > Listen to Pick One instead of arguing with him, you might learn
> something.
> > Tom
>
> Lifters are 1 year old and have 18,000 miles on them. I was not aware a
cam
> and lifters only last 18,000 miles. The heads have less than 25,000 miles
on
> them. I was not aware heads only last 25,000 miles. If you read my posts
in
> this thread you would know that this is a low mileage motor that has been
> cared for and not abused.
>
> Cory
Sorry for being snide in my reply. I was grouchy about something from my day
today when I posted that. For wahtever reason you didn't read the part where
I metnioned the mileage on the motor. No biggie. The motor has low miles on
it and has been broken in properly and treated right, so it should not be
having any bad lifters or anything like that so soon in it's life. I would
expect at least 100,000 miles out of this motor without any major failures,
probably double that though.
I don't understand how a lifter would make the noise that the engine is
aming, and if it is the lifter, why does the noise go away when the engine
is running and I push on the side of the valve spring? I also have taken the
lifter apart and cleaned and inspected it. I soaked it in cleaner and didn't
see anything wrong with it (no abnormal wear, everything appeared alright),
so I put it back in. Before I go pulling the engine apart to get to the
lifter and then taking the lifter apart again and possibly replacing it I'd
like to know how or why a lifter might make that noise and what about
pushing on the side of the valve spring might make the noise stop. I just
don't wanna know why I'm gonna do something before I do it.
Cory Dunkle wrote:
> "Cory Dunkle" <cdnews@comcast.net> wrote in message
> news:4bCdnftdFbc4nqTfRVn-ug@comcast.com...
>
>>"Tom Adkins" <newton5@remove.comcast.net> wrote in message
>>news:3pWdneKOv6YlQaXfRVn-oQ@comcast.com...
>>
>>> Cory,
>>> Get your heads redone and\or (at least) install a new cam and lifters
>>
>>already.
>>
>>> There are lots of hypothetical failure scenarios, but....YOUR LIFTERS
>>
>>ARE WORN OUT.
>>
>>> I appreciate your love of your 67-68 Fords (My first car was a 68
>>>XL\GT)(428\2x4\4-speed :)), but when all is said and done, they wear out
>>
>>after 37
>>
>>>years. No amount of throwing used parts at them will fix the problem.
>>>
>>> Listen to Pick One instead of arguing with him, you might learn
>>
>>something.
>>
>>>Tom
>>
>>Lifters are 1 year old and have 18,000 miles on them. I was not aware a
>
> cam
>
>>and lifters only last 18,000 miles. The heads have less than 25,000 miles
>
> on
>
>>them. I was not aware heads only last 25,000 miles. If you read my posts
>
> in
>
>>this thread you would know that this is a low mileage motor that has been
>>cared for and not abused.
>>
>> Cory
>
>
> Sorry for being snide in my reply. I was grouchy about something from my day
> today when I posted that. For wahtever reason you didn't read the part where
> I metnioned the mileage on the motor. No biggie. The motor has low miles on
> it and has been broken in properly and treated right, so it should not be
> having any bad lifters or anything like that so soon in it's life. I would
> expect at least 100,000 miles out of this motor without any major failures,
> probably double that though.
>
> I don't understand how a lifter would make the noise that the engine is
> aming, and if it is the lifter, why does the noise go away when the engine
> is running and I push on the side of the valve spring? I also have taken the
> lifter apart and cleaned and inspected it. I soaked it in cleaner and didn't
> see anything wrong with it (no abnormal wear, everything appeared alright),
> so I put it back in. Before I go pulling the engine apart to get to the
> lifter and then taking the lifter apart again and possibly replacing it I'd
> like to know how or why a lifter might make that noise and what about
> pushing on the side of the valve spring might make the noise stop. I just
> don't wanna know why I'm gonna do something before I do it.
>
> Cory
>
>
Cory,
As I understand it, there has been a quality control problem with aftermarket
lifters for the last 2-3 years.
I don't now the specifics, but I know a number of rebuilders who have commented on
the fact. Maybe someone else here knows what I'm speaking of? Anyone?
Sorry Cory, last I heard you we're still cobbling on your old 289\302s. I thought
this was a problem with one of those high mileage motors.
BTW, I just picked up a 68 Custom with a 351\3 on the tree. It's roached but the
driveline is OK. Need parts?
"Tom Adkins" <newton5@remove.comcast.net> wrote in message
news:_6CdnfYPCZ0Dj6TfRVn-rg@comcast.com...
> Cory Dunkle wrote:
> > "Cory Dunkle" <cdnews@comcast.net> wrote in message
> > news:4bCdnftdFbc4nqTfRVn-ug@comcast.com...
> >
> >>"Tom Adkins" <newton5@remove.comcast.net> wrote in message
> >>news:3pWdneKOv6YlQaXfRVn-oQ@comcast.com...
> >>
> >>> Cory,
> >>> Get your heads redone and\or (at least) install a new cam and lifters
> >>
> >>already.
> >>
> >>> There are lots of hypothetical failure scenarios, but....YOUR LIFTERS
> >>
> >>ARE WORN OUT.
> >>
> >>> I appreciate your love of your 67-68 Fords (My first car was a 68
> >>>XL\GT)(428\2x4\4-speed :)), but when all is said and done, they wear
out
> >>
> >>after 37
> >>
> >>>years. No amount of throwing used parts at them will fix the problem.
> >>>
> >>> Listen to Pick One instead of arguing with him, you might learn
> >>
> >>something.
> >>
> >>>Tom
> >>
> >>Lifters are 1 year old and have 18,000 miles on them. I was not aware a
> >
> > cam
> >
> >>and lifters only last 18,000 miles. The heads have less than 25,000
miles
> >
> > on
> >
> >>them. I was not aware heads only last 25,000 miles. If you read my posts
> >
> > in
> >
> >>this thread you would know that this is a low mileage motor that has
been
> >>cared for and not abused.
> >>
> >> Cory
> >
> >
> > Sorry for being snide in my reply. I was grouchy about something from my
day
> > today when I posted that. For wahtever reason you didn't read the part
where
> > I metnioned the mileage on the motor. No biggie. The motor has low miles
on
> > it and has been broken in properly and treated right, so it should not
be
> > having any bad lifters or anything like that so soon in it's life. I
would
> > expect at least 100,000 miles out of this motor without any major
failures,
> > probably double that though.
> >
> > I don't understand how a lifter would make the noise that the engine is
> > aming, and if it is the lifter, why does the noise go away when the
engine
> > is running and I push on the side of the valve spring? I also have taken
the
> > lifter apart and cleaned and inspected it. I soaked it in cleaner and
didn't
> > see anything wrong with it (no abnormal wear, everything appeared
alright),
> > so I put it back in. Before I go pulling the engine apart to get to the
> > lifter and then taking the lifter apart again and possibly replacing it
I'd
> > like to know how or why a lifter might make that noise and what about
> > pushing on the side of the valve spring might make the noise stop. I
just
> > don't wanna know why I'm gonna do something before I do it.
> >
> > Cory
> >
> >
> Cory,
> As I understand it, there has been a quality control problem with
aftermarket
> lifters for the last 2-3 years.
> I don't now the specifics, but I know a number of rebuilders who have
commented on
> the fact. Maybe someone else here knows what I'm speaking of? Anyone?
> Sorry Cory, last I heard you we're still cobbling on your old 289\302s.
I thought
> this was a problem with one of those high mileage motors.
> BTW, I just picked up a 68 Custom with a 351\3 on the tree. It's roached
but the
> driveline is OK. Need parts?
>
> Tom
I would love the transmission and clutch setup out of that car (maybe the
steering column and shifter too)! Heck, I've been wanting a bigger motor. I
was thinking of trying a cheap 460 build if the right motor came along. Was
hoping I could find something I could get away with a quick re-ring and new
bearings, and put a C6 behind it, but maybe a 351W would work well enough
(is that 351 an FE or Windsor?). If you seriously wanna part it out I may be
interested in the clutch pedal setup, possibly more in you're close enough
(I'm in NJ).
Anyhow, I kind hate to take the intake off but for the price of a lifter and
an intake manifold gasket it may be worth it even if only to eliminate the
lifter as a problem for sure.
Cory Dunkle wrote:
> "Tom Adkins" <newton5@remove.comcast.net> wrote in message
> news:_6CdnfYPCZ0Dj6TfRVn-rg@comcast.com...
>
>>Cory Dunkle wrote:
>>
>>>"Cory Dunkle" <cdnews@comcast.net> wrote in message
>>>news:4bCdnftdFbc4nqTfRVn-ug@comcast.com...
>>>
>>>
>>>>"Tom Adkins" <newton5@remove.comcast.net> wrote in message
>>>>news:3pWdneKOv6YlQaXfRVn-oQ@comcast.com...
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> Cory,
>>>>> Get your heads redone and\or (at least) install a new cam and lifters
>>>>
>>>>already.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> There are lots of hypothetical failure scenarios, but....YOUR LIFTERS
>>>>
>>>>ARE WORN OUT.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> I appreciate your love of your 67-68 Fords (My first car was a 68
>>>>>XL\GT)(428\2x4\4-speed :)), but when all is said and done, they wear
>
> out
>
>>>>after 37
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>years. No amount of throwing used parts at them will fix the problem.
>>>>>
>>>>> Listen to Pick One instead of arguing with him, you might learn
>>>>
>>>>something.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>Tom
>>>>
>>>>Lifters are 1 year old and have 18,000 miles on them. I was not aware a
>>>
>>>cam
>>>
>>>
>>>>and lifters only last 18,000 miles. The heads have less than 25,000
>
> miles
>
>>>on
>>>
>>>
>>>>them. I was not aware heads only last 25,000 miles. If you read my posts
>>>
>>>in
>>>
>>>
>>>>this thread you would know that this is a low mileage motor that has
>
> been
>
>>>>cared for and not abused.
>>>>
>>>> Cory
>>>
>>>
>>>Sorry for being snide in my reply. I was grouchy about something from my
>
> day
>
>>>today when I posted that. For wahtever reason you didn't read the part
>
> where
>
>>>I metnioned the mileage on the motor. No biggie. The motor has low miles
>
> on
>
>>>it and has been broken in properly and treated right, so it should not
>
> be
>
>>>having any bad lifters or anything like that so soon in it's life. I
>
> would
>
>>>expect at least 100,000 miles out of this motor without any major
>
> failures,
>
>>>probably double that though.
>>>
>>>I don't understand how a lifter would make the noise that the engine is
>>>aming, and if it is the lifter, why does the noise go away when the
>
> engine
>
>>>is running and I push on the side of the valve spring? I also have taken
>
> the
>
>>>lifter apart and cleaned and inspected it. I soaked it in cleaner and
>
> didn't
>
>>>see anything wrong with it (no abnormal wear, everything appeared
>
> alright),
>
>>>so I put it back in. Before I go pulling the engine apart to get to the
>>>lifter and then taking the lifter apart again and possibly replacing it
>
> I'd
>
>>>like to know how or why a lifter might make that noise and what about
>>>pushing on the side of the valve spring might make the noise stop. I
>
> just
>
>>>don't wanna know why I'm gonna do something before I do it.
>>>
>>> Cory
>>>
>>>
>>
>> Cory,
>> As I understand it, there has been a quality control problem with
>
> aftermarket
>
>>lifters for the last 2-3 years.
>> I don't now the specifics, but I know a number of rebuilders who have
>
> commented on
>
>>the fact. Maybe someone else here knows what I'm speaking of? Anyone?
>> Sorry Cory, last I heard you we're still cobbling on your old 289\302s.
>
> I thought
>
>>this was a problem with one of those high mileage motors.
>> BTW, I just picked up a 68 Custom with a 351\3 on the tree. It's roached
>
> but the
>
>>driveline is OK. Need parts?
>>
>>Tom
>
>
> I would love the transmission and clutch setup out of that car (maybe the
> steering column and shifter too)! Heck, I've been wanting a bigger motor. I
> was thinking of trying a cheap 460 build if the right motor came along. Was
> hoping I could find something I could get away with a quick re-ring and new
> bearings, and put a C6 behind it, but maybe a 351W would work well enough
> (is that 351 an FE or Windsor?). If you seriously wanna part it out I may be
> interested in the clutch pedal setup, possibly more in you're close enough
> (I'm in NJ).
>
> Anyhow, I kind hate to take the intake off but for the price of a lifter and
> an intake manifold gasket it may be worth it even if only to eliminate the
> lifter as a problem for sure.
>
> Cory
>
>
Cory,
The 351 in this car was a Cleveland (I was mistaken, it's a 69). We bought it for
the motor. The 3 speed trans is ok but the column is worn out. (Cheap floor shifter).
Contact me off the group newton5@at. comcast.net You can figure that out, no?
I might be able to hook you up with Ford parts.
Tom
"Cory Dunkle" <cdnews@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:xeWdnczbPq2UnqTfRVn-rg@comcast.com...
> "pick one" <try again!> wrote in message
> news:lL2dnY1nxYN9R6XfRVn-sQ@comcast.com...
>>
>> "Cory Dunkle" <cdnews@comcast.net> wrote in message
>> news:JPadncsCaJn2WKXfRVn-gg@comcast.com...
>> > "pick one" <try again!> wrote in message
>> > news:s9SdnedyuJWEH6XfRVn-gA@comcast.com...
>> >>
>> >> "Cory Dunkle" <cdnews@comcast.net> wrote in message
>> >> news:C5Odnfu9xOE606XfRVn-rA@comcast.com...
>> >> >I remember now why I stopped reading and posting to this group. Too
> many
>> >> > smart-asses like you being rude. I think it's clear I've done a
> little
>> > more
>> >> > than just sit there tightening down on the rocker (can't tighten a
>> > lifter,
>> >> > except perhaps with a different spring, smart-ass).
>> >> >
>> >>
>> >> You can over tighten a lifter till the internal spring is collapsed,
> now
>> > it's a
>> >> solid lifter. Once a lifter is adjusted it should never need adjusting.
>> >
>> > Never say never... After 200,000 miles there may be enough wear to need
> a
>> > little adjusting (a common problem with late model 302s with high
> mileage,
>> > slight tick in the valvetrain as the rocker arms are the positive stop
> type
>> > and therefore not adjsutable). There is also the fact that the lock nuts
>> > used on these heads _will_ loosen over time. It's a fact and
> unavoidable.
>> > Using polylocks will prevent rockers backing off, or using two lock nuts
>> > (instead of one) will help. I've never heard of an engine that does not
> need
>> > the rockers adjusted periodically. 200,000 miles and I imagine any
> engine
>> > will make a little rocker noise unless adjusted. You do mention lfiters
>> > needing adjustment though (which lifters can not be adjusted, to my
>> > knowledge), so maybe you are referring to something else. I am assuming
> you
>> > are referring to adjusting the rocker arms.
>> >
>> 300K on my 91 vic, never adjusted. It's non- adjustable. Engine never
> apart.
>> except for an intake gasket. That is only one example. Sorry kid, I've
> been
>> around a hell of a lot longer than you. Just by the way the lifter
> operates and
>> its design, no adjustment needed.
>
>
> Sorry kid, laws of physics and my experience both show that rocker arms will
> need periodic adjustment, unless perhaps polylocks are used.
Show an engine with hydraulic tappets that has a recommended periodic
adjustment. What law of physics are you implying? The fact is that if the lifter
starts to tap it's because of reasons like the internal spring is weak.
Tightening down on it only limits the travel of the plunger. That could and does
cause the plunger to bottom out. You just created a new tap. Because of the
smaller travel of the plunger, less oil is sent to the rocker, you just wiped
out the rocker and valve head. If the bottom of tappet has worn enough to tap,
the cam lobe is worn also. That extra play will damage the rod, rocker and valve
head. A common problem of engine with solid tappets that have not been adjusted
regularly.
Backing off locking nuts? Don't think so.
>Standard
> locknuts will back off over time, especially if they have ever been removed
> after initial installation.
Meaning you did not do the job correctly, they are supposed to be replaced.
> It's a fact, get used to it. In the mean time,
> try learning some basic Usenet etiquette and trimming your quotes.
>
Why dont like to read?
"Cory Dunkle" <cdnews@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:4bCdnftdFbc4nqTfRVn-ug@comcast.com...
> "Tom Adkins" <newton5@remove.comcast.net> wrote in message
> news:3pWdneKOv6YlQaXfRVn-oQ@comcast.com...
>>
>> Cory,
>> Get your heads redone and\or (at least) install a new cam and lifters
> already.
>> There are lots of hypothetical failure scenarios, but....YOUR LIFTERS
> ARE WORN OUT.
>>
>> I appreciate your love of your 67-68 Fords (My first car was a 68
>> XL\GT)(428\2x4\4-speed :)), but when all is said and done, they wear out
> after 37
>> years. No amount of throwing used parts at them will fix the problem.
>>
>> Listen to Pick One instead of arguing with him, you might learn
> something.
>> Tom
>
> Lifters are 1 year old and have 18
