Ford Forums is the premier Ford Forum on the internet. We discuss all Ford models on the forum. Registered Users do not see the above ads. Please Register - It's Free!
<jismquiff@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1138142710.343858.136720@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com...
> The mammoth troubles facing GM, Ford and their auto parts makers are
> merely a symptom of the global leveling of manufacturing that has been
> underway for some years.
And governmental economic policies that encourage, even reward, out
sourcing.
> Stop and think. We're told this week that the average annual wage for
> a Ford family production line worker is an astounding $65,000! Where
> else in the world can an uneducated, ignorant, untalented, unskilled
> slob who tightens bolts make anything approaching that figure?
> Especially when working for a company that can't move its inventory of
> unwanted products!
I happen to know several people who work at the Ford Truck Plant in Norfolk,
Virginia. None of them are uneducated, ignorant, untalented, or unskilled.
In fact they are hard working decent guys. Getting a job at the Ford plant
is not easy. They pick and choose the people they want. I'll bet if you
tried to get a job there, you would have a hard time.
> At least in Germany, where auto workers' pay is nearly comparable to
> their U.S. counterparts, those employees possess technical skills plus
> a minimum high-school education.
And yet German cars are among the least reliable vehicles sold in America.
Interestingly it seems that Mexican built VWs are more reliable than German
built ones. Makes you wonder about all those technical skills you feel the
German posses.
> Of course, in South Korea, such workers make about 20 percent of the
> $65, 000 the American schlubs '"earn." But the Koreans at least
> possess real skills and a real education. And in China, $650 a year
> is real good.
>
> So get used to less, beer-bellied Amer'cun slobs! The good old days
> are never coming again - except for those with education and genuine
> 21st century skills! Globalism is eatin' your lunch!
And how about your lunch? How long before your job is out-sourced to China
or India?
<jismquiff@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1138142710.343858.136720@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com...
> The mammoth troubles facing GM, Ford and their auto parts makers are
> merely a symptom of the global leveling of manufacturing that has been
> underway for some years.
>
> Stop and think. We're told this week that the average annual wage for
> a Ford family production line worker is an astounding $65,000! Where
> else in the world can an uneducated, ignorant, untalented, unskilled
> slob who tightens bolts make anything approaching that figure?
> Especially when working for a company that can't move its inventory of
> unwanted products!
>
> At least in Germany, where auto workers' pay is nearly comparable to
> their U.S. counterparts, those employees possess technical skills plus
> a minimum high-school education.
>
> Of course, in South Korea, such workers make about 20 percent of the
> $65, 000 the American schlubs '"earn." But the Koreans at least
> possess real skills and a real education. And in China, $650 a year
> is real good.
>
> So get used to less, beer-bellied Amer'cun slobs! The good old days
> are never coming again - except for those with education and genuine
> 21st century skills! Globalism is eatin' your lunch!
>
> Really no surprise.
>
Funny how you think $65k is a lot of money. You must not get out much.
"Franky Furter" <Frank@furter.com> wrote in message
news:11tdld4c1mped13@corp.supernews.com...
> Y'all gots to remember that GM Ford and Chrys. can not import there cars
> like the Japanese import cars to the US, so its really an uneven trade.
> And its also the old saying someone elses Ice is always colder.
> The people in the US will sell out to any body given the opportunity to
> either save a buck or to keep up with the jones's and about 20 years ago
> the Jones's bought a Japanese car.
Actually Ford was profitable in Europe and Asia - it lost money in the US.
So it exports and makes money there. Just not here.
"Dan J.S." <me@hyperx.com> wrote in message
news:11tf2t8oik7eie1@news.supernews.com...
>
> "Franky Furter" <Frank@furter.com> wrote in message
> news:11tdld4c1mped13@corp.supernews.com...
> > Y'all gots to remember that GM Ford and Chrys. can not import there
cars
> > like the Japanese import cars to the US, so its really an uneven
trade.
> > And its also the old saying someone elses Ice is always colder.
> > The people in the US will sell out to any body given the opportunity to
> > either save a buck or to keep up with the jones's and about 20 years
ago
> > the Jones's bought a Japanese car.
>
> Actually Ford was profitable in Europe and Asia - it lost money in the US.
> So it exports and makes money there. Just not here.
>
Ford does not export a significant number of cars to Europe. They build them
there. Couple of years ago I rented the British equivalent of the Ford
Taurus. Was much more like the Taurus SHO than the American Taurus.
Comfortable bucket seats, full instrumentation, 5 speed stick , tight
suspension. I suspect that if that if the US Taurus was built like that
sales would improve. I have not driven the European Focus but I have heard
the same good things. The European GM Opel can run with BMW and Mercedes in
Germany. Not the same fit and finish but close enough given the price
differences. The younger people in the US I talk to want similar cars (they
can't afford BMW, Audi and Acura) so they buy Honda, Toyota and Nissan where
they can get a car that is fun to drive.
I am not surprised that the $65k figure includes overtime, etc. That is why
I did not comment on it. I did add a comment on the contract clause that
pays workers 90% even when the plant is closed. Do you have any comment on
that to add?
"JayR" <jryder.10@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1138162544.819053.94040@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
> $65K... HAHA That's with EVERYTHING included into an estimated salaried
> number, guy I USED to WORK for GM in a factory... and I'm telling you
> from the horses MOUTH, ONLY the people that have been working there for
> over 20+ YEARS make anywhere from 40-50K/yr and many of them that's
> with TONS of overtime. $65K is an estimate with the WHOLE healthcare,
> pension plain accounted for! And at the time way back when GM could
> afford to pay out those types of packages, they had little competition.
> They signed contracts with the workers and they SHOULD be honored. If
> anyone should be losing their jobs and PAYING up are the upper
> management execs that could have and DID for see all this competition
> coming. Don't blame the worker to signing for benefits 20 or more years
> ago and still expecting to COLLECT on it. If that busts up the corp,
> then guess what - it's NOT their fault. It's the Exec's that OFFERED
> them the package. I don't see many Execs making 100 of thousands
> offering to take a nice salary cut? Cutting people at the bottom of the
> corp is the easy way out and the easy and trivial way to duck
> responsibility for past and present mismanagement. And the Corporate
> Raiders and takeover specialist just LOVE when this happens. It makes
> this quick and easy money: blame the lowly workers for accepting TOO
> much PAY! haha should they REJECT a nice contract and get paid a
> pittance for working VERY hard and in a very dangerous environment,
> while execs and managers on ALL levels get paid VERY well and enjoy
> equal or better health care packages? What a joke... more Top-down
> responsibility ducking.
> I know some people that make ~100K, but they
> literally work 12-16hr days/365 including all holidays. And the ONLY
> way that they CAN do this is having the TOP level seniority aka they've
> worked there well over 20-30 years. Overtime accounts for a LOT of
> people that earn in the 40K+ bracket. And ONLY people that have worked
> uber long get scheduled high on the list of employees ASKED after every
> shift if they WANT to work overtime... if not, they go home after the
> usual 8hrs... Or sometimes you'll be required to work a Saturday, which
> counts as time+half pay.
> Again, it's a farce to think that everyone that works on the
> assembly line is making ~65K. Not even close buddy. The white collar
> managers make the bulk of the money. My 22year old foreman, who's daddy
> was a high level engineer, was making ~$54K/yr and that's ONLY b/c he
> was a foreman. No LINE worker is making more than a foreman on an
> hourly
> basis.
> Please stop reading the sensationalized headlines from the mass
> money making media, and do some googling to research what the ACTUAL
> salaries and wages are for MOST of the employees. Also, you people need
> to stop blaming the workers for getting paid whatever they can, and
> blame the MANAGEMENT that signs the checks and negotiates the HORRIBLE
> and unprofitable deals for parts and bulk production equipment. The
> WORKER has little say in how much he/she makes, the management DOES.
>
> I Just love the USA... 100's of millions of idiots blaming the common
> worker and lower class for the upper class SELLING out their own
> country for profit. The common worker has little control over the
> direction of a company. Striking is about all they can do, IF they are
> permitted to have a labor union, which is also corrupted by money and
> power, like any other fallible human institution. Show a little
> compassion, for the blue collar worker is NOT the one sending jobs over
> seas for quick profit-&-run deals.... Good day!
>
Their cars can' be that crappy they sell more than Toyota and Honda in the
US.
mike hunt
"Gary L. Burnore" <gburnore@databasix.com> wrote in message
news:dr6glk$kfs$3@blackhelicopter.databasix.com...
> On Tue, 24 Jan 2006 18:00:22 -0500, "Crusader" <white@xyz.com> top
> posted like an ignorant ****ing moron and wrote:
>
>>Isn`t Ford known as Fix Or Repair Daily?
>>That`s what they get.
>
> They? The workers get canned because the management gave them crappy
> cars to build? Heh.
> --
> gburnore at DataBasix dot Com
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------
> How you look depends on where you go.
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Gary L. Burnore | ÝÛ³ºÝ³Þ³ºÝ³³Ýۺݳ޳ºÝ³Ý³Þ³ºÝ³ÝÝÛ³
> | ÝÛ³ºÝ³Þ³ºÝ³³Ýۺݳ޳ºÝ³Ý³Þ³ºÝ³ÝÝÛ³
> Official .sig, Accept no substitutes. | ÝÛ³ºÝ³Þ³ºÝ³³Ýۺݳ޳ºÝ³Ý³Þ³ºÝ³ÝÝÛ³
> | ÝÛ 0 1 7 2 3 / Ý³Þ 3 7 4 9 3 0 Û³
> Black Helicopter Repair Services, Ltd.| Official Proof of Purchase
> ===========================================================================
The American auto makers still sell more vehicles than all of the import
brands combined.
mike hunt
"Sean Elkins" <sean_elkins@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:sean_elkins-7E1872.21072124012006@news.iglou.com...
> In article <dr6glk$kfs$3@blackhelicopter.databasix.com>,
> Gary L. Burnore <gburnore@databasix.com> wrote:
>
>> On Tue, 24 Jan 2006 18:00:22 -0500, "Crusader" <white@xyz.com> top
>> posted like an ignorant ****ing moron and wrote:
>>
>> >Isn`t Ford known as Fix Or Repair Daily?
>> >That`s what they get.
>>
>> They? The workers get canned because the management gave them crappy
>> cars to build? Heh.
>
> It's not that simple: if someone hands you a crappy design to build, at
> least you can show enough self-respect to assemble
> it correctly and tighten all of the bolts.
>
> There's plenty of blame to spread around here: management and workers
> both had a hand in killing the American auto industry.
Linear Mode
