Adam

We have a 97 Mercury Cougar XR7 4.6 v8, the engine will turn over and wont
start, if you spray somthing into the throttle body than it will pop out the
throttle body, could this be the timing chain? Is it possible for the chain
to slip?

Jim Warman

Possible but highly unlikely.... FWIW, this motor has two timing chains...
the chance of both of them skipping time would be astronomical..... if
either one of them comes out of time, it could be very spendy....

I can only suggest that you start with the basics... a code scan is the
first order of the day to determine if there is a "hard" component failure
or not. If all you see are symptomatic codes, progress onto fuel pressure -
checking with a gauge is much more reliable than watching a spurt of gas
stream out of the Schrader valve - I've seen many get fooled at this step.
If we are getting 35ish PSI and we can bleed a sample off the gauge to look
at it..... step the next (I had a 99 F150 late last week with a fuel pump
that could pump and hold 35 PSI of AIR pressure!!!)...... just when you
thought you'd seen and heard everything there is to see and hear.

If we're still looking good, we check for spark and fuel injector pulse....
doesn't matter which first. A noid light is the best bet for injector pulse,
a powered test light is the next best choice and an incandescent test light
can lie to you because the bulb often can't react quickly enough. Injectors
are ground side switched... that is to say that they receive a constant B+
(that's battery voltage) with the key in run. The PCM switches the ground
circuit open and closed. -

If we are testing spark, we are best using a tester like this
http://mactools.com/ProductDetails.aspx?ItemNum=404T . This style
http://www.otctools.com/frames-newcatalog.php3 has lied to me in the past
and I no longer use or recommend them. Since your car uses four coils in a
wasted spark configuration, you will need to test for spark at every spark
plug connection. Clean any debris from the area and inspect each spark plug
well for moisure and crap at the same time. Thos would also be an idela time
to inspect or replace the spark plugs..... if the fuel system is working but
the ignition system isn't we might expect to see wet spark plugs.... if this
is the case, suspect gasoline in the oil and possibly no compression due to
the oil being washed out of the ring lands.

If, for some unGodly reason, we haven't found the cause of our concern by
this point, we can only assume one or more of the following.... we have
plugged cats.... our gasoline isn't as good as we think.... we have a
pooched motor..... or we haven't performed a test step properly using the
appropriate tools.

And you thought I was just another pretty face...

"Adam" <abuse@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:Rhyyf.12698$sq.11675@trnddc01...
> We have a 97 Mercury Cougar XR7 4.6 v8, the engine will turn over and wont
> start, if you spray somthing into the throttle body than it will pop out
> the throttle body, could this be the timing chain? Is it possible for the
> chain to slip?
>
>

Backyard Mechanic

FWIW, Jim... a question:

Doesnt this engine use the 'wasted spark' ignition?

And what are the chances of starter fluid igniting in the opened cylinder?

Just wondering... esp as this is the second post relating that symptom.



"Jim Warman" <mechanic@telusplanet.net> wrote:

> Possible but highly unlikely.... FWIW, this motor has two timing
> chains... the chance of both of them skipping time would be
> astronomical..... if either one of them comes out of time, it could be
> very spendy....

> And you thought I was just another pretty face...
>
> "Adam" <abuse@verizon.net> wrote in message
> news:Rhyyf.12698$sq.11675@trnddc01...
>> We have a 97 Mercury Cougar XR7 4.6 v8, the engine will turn over and
>> wont start, if you spray somthing into the throttle body than it will
>> pop out the throttle body, could this be the timing chain? Is it
>> possible for the chain to slip?
>>
>>
>
>



--
Yeh, I'm a Krusty old Geezer, putting up with my 'smartass' is the price
you pay..DEAL with it!

Backyard Mechanic

"Adam" <abuse@verizon.net> wrote:

> We have a 97 Mercury Cougar XR7 4.6 v8, the engine will turn over and
> wont start, if you spray somthing into the throttle body than it will
> pop out the throttle body, could this be the timing chain? Is it
> possible for the chain to slip?
>
>

Do you hear the fuel pump as you turn key to on?

Should run for 2 seconds or so. Listen closely, while outside car, it's in
fuel tank

--
Yeh, I'm a Krusty old Geezer, putting up with my 'smartass' is the price
you pay..DEAL with it!

Jim Warman

I did mention that this engine uses the wasted spark configuration... though
I admit that I didn't explain the premise ( I would hope that someone with
no knowledge of this would ask rather than nod their heads like a
parcel-deck poodle). Since this system features paired cylinders, when one
cylinder nears TDC and spark occurs, it's running mate is nearing TDC on
exhaust so there shouldn't be any concerns unless a valve train problem is
present. Keeping with our basic "simple stuff first" diagnostics, we are
going to be sure that the most basic requirements are met first before we
venture into more complex issues. Without spark and/or fuel.... there's no
sense in checking other functions.

Whether or not there is backfiring in the intake, smart money is on avoiding
shortcuts.... like going to the doctor - all you want is for him to stick
his finger up your ass..... errrr, I meant all you wanted was a prostate
exam, but they did the temperature, blood pressure, questionaire thing
first.

Before we stick our finger up our motors ass, we need to make sure it's
"breathing"....


"Backyard Mechanic" <pettyfog@yaywho.com> wrote in message
news:Xns974CE00DEA3Fpettyfogery@207.115.17.102...
> FWIW, Jim... a question:
>
> Doesnt this engine use the 'wasted spark' ignition?
>
> And what are the chances of starter fluid igniting in the opened cylinder?
>
> Just wondering... esp as this is the second post relating that symptom.
>
>
>
> "Jim Warman" <mechanic@telusplanet.net> wrote:
>
>> Possible but highly unlikely.... FWIW, this motor has two timing
>> chains... the chance of both of them skipping time would be
>> astronomical..... if either one of them comes out of time, it could be
>> very spendy....
>
>> And you thought I was just another pretty face...
>>
>> "Adam" <abuse@verizon.net> wrote in message
>> news:Rhyyf.12698$sq.11675@trnddc01...
>>> We have a 97 Mercury Cougar XR7 4.6 v8, the engine will turn over and
>>> wont start, if you spray somthing into the throttle body than it will
>>> pop out the throttle body, could this be the timing chain? Is it
>>> possible for the chain to slip?
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
> --
> Yeh, I'm a Krusty old Geezer, putting up with my 'smartass' is the price
> you pay..DEAL with it!

Backyard Mechanic

"Jim Warman" <mechanic@telusplanet.net> wrote:

> I did mention that this engine uses the wasted spark configuration...
> though I admit that I didn't explain the premise ( I would hope that
> someone with no knowledge of this would ask rather than nod their
> heads like a parcel-deck poodle). Since this system features paired
> cylinders, when one cylinder nears TDC and spark occurs, it's running
> mate is nearing TDC on exhaust so there shouldn't be any concerns
> unless a valve train problem is present. Keeping with our basic
> "simple stuff first" diagnostics, we are going to be sure that the
> most basic requirements are met first before we venture into more
> complex issues. Without spark and/or fuel.... there's no sense in
> checking other functions.
>

Well, my point on that is that if it's 180 out, spraying starter into the
intake, while the exhaust may still be gapped might cause a pop.

Plus 'lean' condition due to choke open when cold often caused carb back-
popping as I recall.




--
Yeh, I'm a Krusty old Geezer, putting up with my 'smartass' is the price
you pay..DEAL with it!