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Old 05-04-2005, 18:01   #1 (permalink)
Steve Forester
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Posts: n/a
Two O2 Sensor Questions...

Are used or remanufactured O2 sensors sold as replacements for
defective O2 sensors?

Is using an O2 sensor from a go-fetch bone yard even a good idea?

TIA,

Steve
xxxgfr92yxxx@hotmail.com
Remove the spam-spoofing triple x's to email me directly.

=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+
=+= Sarcastic remarks are always welcome!
=+= They might as well be welcome since...
=+= I am going to get them anyway.
=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+



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Old 05-04-2005, 18:01   #2 (permalink)
Lawrence Glickman
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Posts: n/a
Re: Two O2 Sensor Questions...

On Wed, 4 May 2005 20:04:59 -0400, "Steve Forester"
<xxgfr92yxx@yahoo.com> wrote:

>Are used or remanufactured O2 sensors sold as replacements for
>defective O2 sensors?


no.

>Is using an O2 sensor from a go-fetch bone yard even a good idea?


Is getting your spark plugs from a go-fetch a good idea?

>TIA,
>
>Steve
>xxxgfr92yxxx@hotmail.com
>Remove the spam-spoofing triple x's to email me directly.
>
>=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+
>=+= Sarcastic remarks are always welcome!
>=+= They might as well be welcome since...
>=+= I am going to get them anyway.
>=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+
>
>


  Reply With Quote
Old 05-04-2005, 18:01   #3 (permalink)
Steve Forester
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Re: Two O2 Sensor Questions...

Is it THAT stupid of an idea???




"Lawrence Glickman" <Lawrence_Glickman@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:3mpi71thgpkkft0oidj4d5sqpento7dldj@4ax.com...
> On Wed, 4 May 2005 20:04:59 -0400, "Steve Forester"
> <xxgfr92yxx@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>>Are used or remanufactured O2 sensors sold as replacements for
>>defective O2 sensors?

>
> no.
>
>>Is using an O2 sensor from a go-fetch bone yard even a good idea?

>
> Is getting your spark plugs from a go-fetch a good idea?
>
>>TIA,
>>
>>Steve
>>xxxgfr92yxxx@hotmail.com
>>Remove the spam-spoofing triple x's to email me directly.
>>
>>=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+
>>=+= Sarcastic remarks are always welcome!
>>=+= They might as well be welcome since...
>>=+= I am going to get them anyway.
>>=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+
>>
>>

>



  Reply With Quote
Old 05-04-2005, 18:01   #4 (permalink)
Lawrence Glickman
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Re: Two O2 Sensor Questions...

On Wed, 4 May 2005 20:26:33 -0400, "Steve Forester"
<xxgfr92yxx@yahoo.com> wrote:

>Is it THAT stupid of an idea???


well I didn't use the word stupid.
I mean to say I don't think it is a GOOD idea.

I didn't mean to imply stupidity, what I am saying is buy the stuff
new in the box, otherwise you don't know what you're getting.

Lg


>
>
>
>
>"Lawrence Glickman" <Lawrence_Glickman@comcast.net> wrote in message
>news:3mpi71thgpkkft0oidj4d5sqpento7dldj@4ax.com...
>> On Wed, 4 May 2005 20:04:59 -0400, "Steve Forester"
>> <xxgfr92yxx@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>
>>>Are used or remanufactured O2 sensors sold as replacements for
>>>defective O2 sensors?

>>
>> no.
>>
>>>Is using an O2 sensor from a go-fetch bone yard even a good idea?

>>
>> Is getting your spark plugs from a go-fetch a good idea?
>>
>>>TIA,
>>>
>>>Steve
>>>xxxgfr92yxxx@hotmail.com
>>>Remove the spam-spoofing triple x's to email me directly.
>>>
>>>=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+
>>>=+= Sarcastic remarks are always welcome!
>>>=+= They might as well be welcome since...
>>>=+= I am going to get them anyway.
>>>=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+
>>>
>>>

>>

>


  Reply With Quote
Old 05-04-2005, 18:01   #5 (permalink)
Steve Forester
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Re: Two O2 Sensor Questions...

OK, but I can pull one from a go-fetch boneyard for a fin or spend $200 at
the dealership... that is a big difference!

So, if I understand your caveat, it may not be such a bad idea, no?

Steve
xxxgfr92yxxx@hotmail.com
Remove the spam-spoofing triple x's to email me directly.





"Lawrence Glickman" <Lawrence_Glickman@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:e9qi71lb8mvvueanbvjhsfgq45nnfptv2p@4ax.com...
> On Wed, 4 May 2005 20:26:33 -0400, "Steve Forester"
> <xxgfr92yxx@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>>Is it THAT stupid of an idea???

>
> well I didn't use the word stupid.
> I mean to say I don't think it is a GOOD idea.
>
> I didn't mean to imply stupidity, what I am saying is buy the stuff
> new in the box, otherwise you don't know what you're getting.
>
> Lg
>
>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>"Lawrence Glickman" <Lawrence_Glickman@comcast.net> wrote in message
>>news:3mpi71thgpkkft0oidj4d5sqpento7dldj@4ax.com...
>>> On Wed, 4 May 2005 20:04:59 -0400, "Steve Forester"
>>> <xxgfr92yxx@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>>Are used or remanufactured O2 sensors sold as replacements for
>>>>defective O2 sensors?
>>>
>>> no.
>>>
>>>>Is using an O2 sensor from a go-fetch bone yard even a good idea?
>>>
>>> Is getting your spark plugs from a go-fetch a good idea?
>>>
>>>>TIA,
>>>>
>>>>Steve
>>>>xxxgfr92yxxx@hotmail.com
>>>>Remove the spam-spoofing triple x's to email me directly.
>>>>
>>>>=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+
>>>>=+= Sarcastic remarks are always welcome!
>>>>=+= They might as well be welcome since...
>>>>=+= I am going to get them anyway.
>>>>=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+
>>>>
>>>>
>>>

>>

>



  Reply With Quote
Old 05-04-2005, 18:01   #6 (permalink)
Tom Adkins
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Re: Two O2 Sensor Questions...

Steve Forester wrote:
> Is it THAT stupid of an idea???


Yes. Used O2 sensors are in the same category as used brake pads, spark plugs,
windshield wipers, mufflers, ball joints, water pumps etc. Would you buy these things
used and put them on your car? You will replace the O2 sensor(s) on your car, maybe,
once in 10 years. At$100 for a pair spread over 10 years, that's pretty cheap. O2
sensors actually rarely fail. Do you think yours are bad?
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Old 05-04-2005, 19:01   #7 (permalink)
Steve Forester
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Re: Two O2 Sensor Questions...

"Tom Adkins" <newton5@remove.comcast.net> wrote in message
news:4L2dncB929Oh9uTfRVn-vQ@comcast.com...
> Steve Forester wrote:
>> Is it THAT stupid of an idea???

>
> Yes. Used O2 sensors are in the same category as used brake pads, spark
> plugs, windshield wipers, mufflers, ball joints, water pumps etc. Would
> you buy these things used and put them on your car? You will replace the
> O2 sensor(s) on your car, maybe, once in 10 years. At$100 for a pair
> spread over 10 years, that's pretty cheap. O2 sensors actually rarely
> fail. Do you think yours are bad?




Yes, a local (and trusted) mechanic did a once-over on my 93 GT
because of:

(i) a miss -- usually accompanied by, but not always, a backfire -- at
all RPMs or speeds, and

(ii) the engine when "cold" -- December or July -- stalls out after about
5 seconds on the first start-up, I mean 5 seconds after each and
every first cold-engine start-up, but on the second try, attempted
immediately after the stall, the engine always starts "normally" and
idles "normally" which it must do -- December and July -- for 5
minutes before I attempt to drive it. If I tried to promptly drive off
after the second start, the car would sputter and backfire for miles.

His once-over resulted in:
o Good compression across all 8 cylinders,
o Normal oil pressure at warm idle, but borderline-low oil
pressure at 2,000 RPM,
o MAF sensor code, and
o O2 sensor code.

Steve
xxxgfr92yxxx@hotmail.com
Remove the spam-spoofing triple x's to email me directly.

=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+
=+= Sarcastic remarks are always welcome!
=+= They might as well be welcome since...
=+= I am going to get them anyway.
=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+



  Reply With Quote
Old 05-04-2005, 19:01   #8 (permalink)
Shoe Salesman
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Re: Two O2 Sensor Questions...

sounds like it needs a maf cleaning, throttle bore cleaning, IAC cleaning,
and a new O2 according to the code.

As far as prices on O2s, check Autozone, pep boys, ect. The price will most
likely be much lower. O2 sensors wear out, getting one from a junk yard is
like getting an oil filter from the junk yard. Not a good idea.


"Steve Forester" <xxgfr92yxx@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:yOydnZCRj4Jl7eTfRVn-1A@comcast.com...
> "Tom Adkins" <newton5@remove.comcast.net> wrote in message
> news:4L2dncB929Oh9uTfRVn-vQ@comcast.com...
>> Steve Forester wrote:
>>> Is it THAT stupid of an idea???

>>
>> Yes. Used O2 sensors are in the same category as used brake pads, spark
>> plugs, windshield wipers, mufflers, ball joints, water pumps etc. Would
>> you buy these things used and put them on your car? You will replace the
>> O2 sensor(s) on your car, maybe, once in 10 years. At$100 for a pair
>> spread over 10 years, that's pretty cheap. O2 sensors actually rarely
>> fail. Do you think yours are bad?

>
>
>
> Yes, a local (and trusted) mechanic did a once-over on my 93 GT
> because of:
>
> (i) a miss -- usually accompanied by, but not always, a backfire -- at
> all RPMs or speeds, and
>
> (ii) the engine when "cold" -- December or July -- stalls out after about
> 5 seconds on the first start-up, I mean 5 seconds after each and
> every first cold-engine start-up, but on the second try, attempted
> immediately after the stall, the engine always starts "normally" and
> idles "normally" which it must do -- December and July -- for 5
> minutes before I attempt to drive it. If I tried to promptly drive off
> after the second start, the car would sputter and backfire for miles.
>
> His once-over resulted in:
> o Good compression across all 8 cylinders,
> o Normal oil pressure at warm idle, but borderline-low oil
> pressure at 2,000 RPM,
> o MAF sensor code, and
> o O2 sensor code.
>
> Steve
> xxxgfr92yxxx@hotmail.com
> Remove the spam-spoofing triple x's to email me directly.
>
> =+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+
> =+= Sarcastic remarks are always welcome!
> =+= They might as well be welcome since...
> =+= I am going to get them anyway.
> =+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+
>
>
>



  Reply With Quote
Old 05-04-2005, 19:01   #9 (permalink)
Jim Warman
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Re: Two O2 Sensor Questions...

For the cold start.... your PCM isn't even paying any attention to the O2
signal (simply because it is still too cold to generate a signal). If you
are recieving an O2 HEATER code, then the problem could well be an O2
sensor.... if you are getting a code like "O2 always lean", you more than
likely have some other problem making the O2 sensor experience a mixture
that is always lean. Changing the O2 sensor over and over and over wont fix
that.

Let's take a look at your misfire - sometimes with a backfire and that makes
me want to say ignition... Somewhere, somehow a mixture is being lit at the
wrong time or unburned fuel is getting into the exhaust and lighting off.
One thing that an ignition misfire will deliver on an OBD1 car, is a lean
mixture (important to remember that the O2 sensor can only measure oxygen
content - as far as mixture goes, it dont know shit from shinola... all it
knows is high O2 content and low O2 content).

So... we have a misifre dumping a lot of (unspent) O2 down the pipe and a
lean code????

Let's take a look at your MAF code... this car is over 10 years old and most
likely has it's original MAF sensor..... complete with it's lovely, warm
little fur coat. This collection of debris that gets past the air filter
element has an insulating effect on the sensing element in the MAF sensor...
the PCM thinks less air is getting into the motor than really is..... Less
air, did I say??? The PCM sees "less air" and reduces injector on time.....
leaning out the mixture....

So.... we have a misfire and an inaccurate MAF indication dumping a lot of
O2 down the pipe????

One last comment on the oil pressure.... if the pressure is "good" at idle
but approaching low at rpm, I would be concerned about oil pump
starvation... crap on the pick up screen as a likely cause.

Time to go back and have a chat with your mechanic....


"Steve Forester" <xxgfr92yxx@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:yOydnZCRj4Jl7eTfRVn-1A@comcast.com...
> "Tom Adkins" <newton5@remove.comcast.net> wrote in message
> news:4L2dncB929Oh9uTfRVn-vQ@comcast.com...
> > Steve Forester wrote:
> >> Is it THAT stupid of an idea???

> >
> > Yes. Used O2 sensors are in the same category as used brake pads, spark
> > plugs, windshield wipers, mufflers, ball joints, water pumps etc. Would
> > you buy these things used and put them on your car? You will replace the
> > O2 sensor(s) on your car, maybe, once in 10 years. At$100 for a pair
> > spread over 10 years, that's pretty cheap. O2 sensors actually rarely
> > fail. Do you think yours are bad?

>
>
>
> Yes, a local (and trusted) mechanic did a once-over on my 93 GT
> because of:
>
> (i) a miss -- usually accompanied by, but not always, a backfire -- at
> all RPMs or speeds, and
>
> (ii) the engine when "cold" -- December or July -- stalls out after about
> 5 seconds on the first start-up, I mean 5 seconds after each and
> every first cold-engine start-up, but on the second try, attempted
> immediately after the stall, the engine always starts "normally" and
> idles "normally" which it must do -- December and July -- for 5
> minutes before I attempt to drive it. If I tried to promptly drive

off
> after the second start, the car would sputter and backfire for miles.
>
> His once-over resulted in:
> o Good compression across all 8 cylinders,
> o Normal oil pressure at warm idle, but borderline-low oil
> pressure at 2,000 RPM,
> o MAF sensor code, and
> o O2 sensor code.
>
> Steve
> xxxgfr92yxxx@hotmail.com
> Remove the spam-spoofing triple x's to email me directly.
>
> =+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+
> =+= Sarcastic remarks are always welcome!
> =+= They might as well be welcome since...
> =+= I am going to get them anyway.
> =+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+
>
>
>



  Reply With Quote
Old 05-04-2005, 21:01   #10 (permalink)
Steve Forester
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Re: Two O2 Sensor Questions...

Jim,

(1) Let's ignore the cold start for now.

(2) Let's take a look at the misfire and assume the ignition is the culprit.

Here is what I have done related to the ignition recently either to
address potential ignition-related causes or because I thought it
might just be a good idea without any knowledgeable rationale:
o Timing: Adjusted to OEM Specifications
o Ignition Coil: Replaced (Aftermarket)
o Distributor Cap and Rotor: Replaced (Aftermarket)
o Distributor Stator: I have been thinking about replacing
it, but have not done so yet
o Sparks Plugs: Replaced (OEM)
o Wires: Replaced (Aftermarket)
o Alternator: Replaced (Remanufactured)

Are there other "places" where ignition-related problems can
originate?

Can poor harness connections cause ignition problems that
then cause misfiring?

(3) Let's take a look at the MAF code.

Since the car is over 10 years old and does still have its
original MAF sensor, why don't I just clean the sensing
element?

(4) Finally, let's look at the oil pressure.

If there is no downside in attempting the following, why don't
I just clean whatever crap is on the pick-up screen?

(5) I am my mechanic. the "local and trusted mechanic" is a good
friend, whose profession is repairing automobiles, and has all
of the sophisticated stuff necessary to do so professionally.

I eagerly await your comments, corrections and suggestions!

Steve
xxxgfr92yxxx@hotmail.com
Remove the spam-spoofing triple x's to email me directly.



"Jim Warman" <mechanic@tenalpsulet.net> wrote in message
news:dHeee.68570$3V3.39186@edtnps89...
> For the cold start.... your PCM isn't even paying any attention to the O2
> signal (simply because it is still too cold to generate a signal). If you
> are recieving an O2 HEATER code, then the problem could well be an O2
> sensor.... if you are getting a code like "O2 always lean", you more than
> likely have some other problem making the O2 sensor experience a mixture
> that is always lean. Changing the O2 sensor over and over and over wont
> fix that.
>
> Let's take a look at your misfire - sometimes with a backfire and that
> makes me want to say ignition... Somewhere, somehow a mixture is
> being lit at the wrong time or unburned fuel is getting into the exhaust
> and
> lighting off. One thing that an ignition misfire will deliver on an OBD1
> car,
> is a lean mixture (important to remember that the O2 sensor can only
> measure oxygen content - as far as mixture goes, it dont know shit from
> shinola... all it knows is high O2 content and low O2 content).
>
> So... we have a misifre dumping a lot of (unspent) O2 down the pipe and a
> lean code????
>
> Let's take a look at your MAF code... this car is over 10 years old and
> most likely has it's original MAF sensor..... complete with it's lovely,
> warm little fur coat. This collection of debris that gets past the air
> filter
> element has an insulating effect on the sensing element in the MAF
> sensor... the PCM thinks less air is getting into the motor than really
> is..... Less air, did I say??? The PCM sees "less air" and reduces
> injector on time..... leaning out the mixture....
>
> So.... we have a misfire and an inaccurate MAF indication dumping a lot of
> O2 down the pipe????
>
> One last comment on the oil pressure.... if the pressure is "good" at idle
> but approaching low at rpm, I would be concerned about oil pump
> starvation... crap on the pick up screen as a likely cause.
>
> Time to go back and have a chat with your mechanic....
>
>


[SNIP]



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