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Old 07-30-2005, 09:01   #1 (permalink)
Alan E. Seelbach
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Factory oil filters redux

Last week I posted how difficult it is to remove FACTORY installed oil
filters. Most post repliers, except for Jim Warman, didn't seem to
understand my post and tried to help me install a new filter (oil gasket,
hand tighten, etc.).

Well today I had to remove another FACTORY installed oil filter on my wife's
Explorer. What we are dealing with here is a 2005 4.6 Explorer. The filter
is a Ford FL 820S. I have a socket that I got from AutoZone that fits the
FL 820S perfectly...but it doesn't fit the factory filter...it slips while
turning, and this is the 4th time I have experienced this problem.

I finally got the filter off since I have quite a bit of experience with
these factory installed filters...but not without some blood being shed.

My conclusion is that the factory filters ARE NOT FL 820S filters. They are
a RCH smaller in diameter of the FL 820S, have NO markings as to what they
really are, and to paraphrase Jim Warman...they were put on by Popeye.

Anyhow, I now have both factory filters replaced (I have 2 Explorers) and
subsequent removals will be a snap since I can remove the filters that I
install and the removal socket now fits.

I am curious if any other folks had this experience.

Sorry for the rant.

Al in Poughkeepsie, NY


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Old 07-31-2005, 09:02   #2 (permalink)
Ed Mann
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Posts: n/a
Re: Factory oil filters redux

I have had a similar experience on my wife's Toyota Sienna. The factory
filter was a different size than the dealer-sold replacement.

"Alan E. Seelbach" <alseelbach@optonline.net> wrote in message
news:tAMGe.13138$Kx6.118@fe12.lga...
> Last week I posted how difficult it is to remove FACTORY installed oil
> filters. Most post repliers, except for Jim Warman, didn't seem to
> understand my post and tried to help me install a new filter (oil gasket,
> hand tighten, etc.).
>
> Well today I had to remove another FACTORY installed oil filter on my

wife's
> Explorer. What we are dealing with here is a 2005 4.6 Explorer. The

filter
> is a Ford FL 820S. I have a socket that I got from AutoZone that fits the
> FL 820S perfectly...but it doesn't fit the factory filter...it slips while
> turning, and this is the 4th time I have experienced this problem.
>
> I finally got the filter off since I have quite a bit of experience with
> these factory installed filters...but not without some blood being shed.
>
> My conclusion is that the factory filters ARE NOT FL 820S filters. They

are
> a RCH smaller in diameter of the FL 820S, have NO markings as to what they
> really are, and to paraphrase Jim Warman...they were put on by Popeye.
>
> Anyhow, I now have both factory filters replaced (I have 2 Explorers) and
> subsequent removals will be a snap since I can remove the filters that I
> install and the removal socket now fits.
>
> I am curious if any other folks had this experience.
>
> Sorry for the rant.
>
> Al in Poughkeepsie, NY
>
>



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Old 07-31-2005, 11:01   #3 (permalink)
Vito
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Re: Factory oil filters redux

Alan

Not too clear on the problem here (unless it's a clearance problem).

My 96 EB 5.0 also uses the Motorcraft FL-820S - it also has an Oil Cooler
installed as part
of the tow package. I change my oil every 3K miles (currently at 204K) and
have never seen any
way of applying a SOCKET to the filter to remove it. I normally use a
filter wrench just to loosen it,
then twist it off.
"Ed Mann" <edlmann@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:F16He.885$ns.227@newsread1.news.atl.earthlink.net...
>I have had a similar experience on my wife's Toyota Sienna. The factory
> filter was a different size than the dealer-sold replacement.
>
> "Alan E. Seelbach" <alseelbach@optonline.net> wrote in message
> news:tAMGe.13138$Kx6.118@fe12.lga...
>> Last week I posted how difficult it is to remove FACTORY installed oil
>> filters. Most post repliers, except for Jim Warman, didn't seem to
>> understand my post and tried to help me install a new filter (oil gasket,
>> hand tighten, etc.).
>>
>> Well today I had to remove another FACTORY installed oil filter on my

> wife's
>> Explorer. What we are dealing with here is a 2005 4.6 Explorer. The

> filter
>> is a Ford FL 820S. I have a socket that I got from AutoZone that fits
>> the
>> FL 820S perfectly...but it doesn't fit the factory filter...it slips
>> while
>> turning, and this is the 4th time I have experienced this problem.
>>
>> I finally got the filter off since I have quite a bit of experience with
>> these factory installed filters...but not without some blood being shed.
>>
>> My conclusion is that the factory filters ARE NOT FL 820S filters. They

> are
>> a RCH smaller in diameter of the FL 820S, have NO markings as to what
>> they
>> really are, and to paraphrase Jim Warman...they were put on by Popeye.
>>
>> Anyhow, I now have both factory filters replaced (I have 2 Explorers) and
>> subsequent removals will be a snap since I can remove the filters that I
>> install and the removal socket now fits.
>>
>> I am curious if any other folks had this experience.
>>
>> Sorry for the rant.
>>
>> Al in Poughkeepsie, NY
>>
>>

>
>



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Old 07-31-2005, 11:01   #4 (permalink)
Alan E. Seelbach
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Re: Factory oil filters redux


"Vito" <vitointn@charter.net> wrote in message
news:l%6He.3277$5B2.3094@fe04.lga...
> Alan
>
> Not too clear on the problem here (unless it's a clearance problem).
>
> My 96 EB 5.0 also uses the Motorcraft FL-820S - it also has an Oil Cooler
> installed as part
> of the tow package. I change my oil every 3K miles (currently at 204K)
> and have never seen any
> way of applying a SOCKET to the filter to remove it. I normally use a
> filter wrench just to loosen it,
> then twist it off.


Vito,
The problem is not a clearance problem...I can get the socket on the
filter with a 3/8 drive and a 6" extension. The problem is that it slips on
the FACTORY installed oil filter. My conclusion is that the filter that
comes from the factory is NOT a FL-820S...it's a tad smaller in diameter.
Once that piece of crap is removed and replaced with a FL-820S everything is
fine, and removing it will now be a snap cause I've got the right filter and
the right removal tool.

Ed, the Toyota guy, who posted just before you seems to have had the
same experience that I've had (4 times now).

I'm probably making too much of this now, but getting that factory
filter off can be some pain in the ass.

Thank you both for your responses.

Al in Poughkeepsie, NY



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Old 08-01-2005, 06:01   #5 (permalink)
C. E. White
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Re: Factory oil filters redux


"Alan E. Seelbach" <alseelbach@optonline.net> wrote in message
news:tAMGe.13138$Kx6.118@fe12.lga...
> Last week I posted how difficult it is to remove FACTORY installed oil
> filters. Most post repliers, except for Jim Warman, didn't seem to
> understand my post and tried to help me install a new filter (oil gasket,
> hand tighten, etc.).
>
> Well today I had to remove another FACTORY installed oil filter on my

wife's
> Explorer. What we are dealing with here is a 2005 4.6 Explorer. The

filter
> is a Ford FL 820S. I have a socket that I got from AutoZone that fits the
> FL 820S perfectly...but it doesn't fit the factory filter...it slips while
> turning, and this is the 4th time I have experienced this problem.
>
> I finally got the filter off since I have quite a bit of experience with
> these factory installed filters...but not without some blood being shed.
>
> My conclusion is that the factory filters ARE NOT FL 820S filters. They

are
> a RCH smaller in diameter of the FL 820S, have NO markings as to what they
> really are, and to paraphrase Jim Warman...they were put on by Popeye.


I had a similar experience replacing the OE filter on my Father's Freestyle.
It was labeled with a part number and not much else (well it did have the EU
Wheelie Bin with an X logo - which means don't throw in the trash). I assume
the Ford Powertain divison bids out the filters just like the Parts and
Service division does. Maybe different companies win the bids. Or maybe
filters for new engines have different requirements. Or, as the funky logo
suggests, maybe the powertrain division has worldwide requirements that are
different than US parts and service. I suspect that they tighten the filter
by machine, so it might be that the factory filters have to have a special
case configuration so that they fit the equipment in the engine plants.

As for why they are so tight - better to make it hard to remove one, than
lose an engine becasue one came loose. In theory a dealer should check
vehicles for oil leaks, etc. before delivery. However, somethimes vehicles
are driven a long ways before they are actually "delivered" (like when one
dealer swaps cars with another, or sends a vehicle out to have special
equipment added).

Ed


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Old 08-04-2005, 18:01   #6 (permalink)
Spud Unger
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Re: Factory oil filters redux

i removed mine with some difficulty too. my problem was that the rubber
gasket stuck and i didnt realize it until after i installed the new
filter and filled truck with oil. i won't ever make that mistake again.

Alan E. Seelbach wrote:
> Last week I posted how difficult it is to remove FACTORY installed oil
> filters. Most post repliers, except for Jim Warman, didn't seem to
> understand my post and tried to help me install a new filter (oil gasket,
> hand tighten, etc.).
>
> Well today I had to remove another FACTORY installed oil filter on my wife's
> Explorer. What we are dealing with here is a 2005 4.6 Explorer. The filter
> is a Ford FL 820S. I have a socket that I got from AutoZone that fits the
> FL 820S perfectly...but it doesn't fit the factory filter...it slips while
> turning, and this is the 4th time I have experienced this problem.
>
> I finally got the filter off since I have quite a bit of experience with
> these factory installed filters...but not without some blood being shed.
>
> My conclusion is that the factory filters ARE NOT FL 820S filters. They are
> a RCH smaller in diameter of the FL 820S, have NO markings as to what they
> really are, and to paraphrase Jim Warman...they were put on by Popeye.
>
> Anyhow, I now have both factory filters replaced (I have 2 Explorers) and
> subsequent removals will be a snap since I can remove the filters that I
> install and the removal socket now fits.
>
> I am curious if any other folks had this experience.
>
> Sorry for the rant.
>
> Al in Poughkeepsie, NY
>
>



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Old 08-05-2005, 08:02   #7 (permalink)
Dave
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Re: Factory oil filters redux

I finally got tired of those stupid filter wrenches, and busted knuckles.

My tried and true method, if your careful. Put an oil pan underneath it,
hammer a big screwdriver THROUGH the filter, and twist.

This has never failed. You have to be careful not to tear the filter too
much after you puncture it. Usually it will come off before it starts to
tear.

I hear people cringing right now, and I feel a flame coming, but you know
what? I'm not frustrated taking off filters anymore, and it works for me
and I'm very careful.

Dave


"Alan E. Seelbach" <alseelbach@optonline.net> wrote in message
news:tAMGe.13138$Kx6.118@fe12.lga...
> Last week I posted how difficult it is to remove FACTORY installed oil
> filters. Most post repliers, except for Jim Warman, didn't seem to
> understand my post and tried to help me install a new filter (oil gasket,
> hand tighten, etc.).
>
> Well today I had to remove another FACTORY installed oil filter on my
> wife's Explorer. What we are dealing with here is a 2005 4.6 Explorer.
> The filter is a Ford FL 820S. I have a socket that I got from AutoZone
> that fits the FL 820S perfectly...but it doesn't fit the factory
> filter...it slips while turning, and this is the 4th time I have
> experienced this problem.
>
> I finally got the filter off since I have quite a bit of experience with
> these factory installed filters...but not without some blood being shed.
>
> My conclusion is that the factory filters ARE NOT FL 820S filters. They
> are a RCH smaller in diameter of the FL 820S, have NO markings as to what
> they really are, and to paraphrase Jim Warman...they were put on by
> Popeye.
>
> Anyhow, I now have both factory filters replaced (I have 2 Explorers) and
> subsequent removals will be a snap since I can remove the filters that I
> install and the removal socket now fits.
>
> I am curious if any other folks had this experience.
>
> Sorry for the rant.
>
> Al in Poughkeepsie, NY
>



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Old 08-05-2005, 23:01   #8 (permalink)
Ashton Crusher
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Re: Factory oil filters redux

On Fri, 5 Aug 2005 07:22:08 -0700, "Dave" <johndsykes@hotmail.com>
wrote:

>I finally got tired of those stupid filter wrenches, and busted knuckles.
>
>My tried and true method, if your careful. Put an oil pan underneath it,
>hammer a big screwdriver THROUGH the filter, and twist.
>
>This has never failed. You have to be careful not to tear the filter too
>much after you puncture it. Usually it will come off before it starts to
>tear.
>
>I hear people cringing right now, and I feel a flame coming, but you know
>what? I'm not frustrated taking off filters anymore, and it works for me
>and I'm very careful.
>
>Dave
>


I've done that but only when I wound up with it crushing when I tried
the normal compression band type wrench on it. I would never do that
as a first resort since if you still have a problem getting it off
after punching a hole in it you couldn't even drive it to a repair
shop to let them take a whack at it.


>
>"Alan E. Seelbach" <alseelbach@optonline.net> wrote in message
>news:tAMGe.13138$Kx6.118@fe12.lga...
>> Last week I posted how difficult it is to remove FACTORY installed oil
>> filters. Most post repliers, except for Jim Warman, didn't seem to
>> understand my post and tried to help me install a new filter (oil gasket,
>> hand tighten, etc.).
>>
>> Well today I had to remove another FACTORY installed oil filter on my
>> wife's Explorer. What we are dealing with here is a 2005 4.6 Explorer.
>> The filter is a Ford FL 820S. I have a socket that I got from AutoZone
>> that fits the FL 820S perfectly...but it doesn't fit the factory
>> filter...it slips while turning, and this is the 4th time I have
>> experienced this problem.
>>
>> I finally got the filter off since I have quite a bit of experience with
>> these factory installed filters...but not without some blood being shed.
>>
>> My conclusion is that the factory filters ARE NOT FL 820S filters. They
>> are a RCH smaller in diameter of the FL 820S, have NO markings as to what
>> they really are, and to paraphrase Jim Warman...they were put on by
>> Popeye.
>>
>> Anyhow, I now have both factory filters replaced (I have 2 Explorers) and
>> subsequent removals will be a snap since I can remove the filters that I
>> install and the removal socket now fits.
>>
>> I am curious if any other folks had this experience.
>>
>> Sorry for the rant.
>>
>> Al in Poughkeepsie, NY
>>

>


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Old 08-07-2005, 09:01   #9 (permalink)
Ed Mann
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Re: Factory oil filters redux

I've heard this advice and followed it once circa 1984. Tore the filter,
which never moved, and had the car towed to a mechanic.

A strap wrench workd better than anything else for me.

"Dave" <johndsykes@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:guOdnZ2nj9iP627fRVn-ug@newedgenetworks.com...
> I finally got tired of those stupid filter wrenches, and busted knuckles.
>
> My tried and true method, if your careful. Put an oil pan underneath it,
> hammer a big screwdriver THROUGH the filter, and twist.
>
> This has never failed. You have to be careful not to tear the filter too
> much after you puncture it. Usually it will come off before it starts to
> tear.
>
> I hear people cringing right now, and I feel a flame coming, but you know
> what? I'm not frustrated taking off filters anymore, and it works for me
> and I'm very careful.
>
> Dave
>
>
> "Alan E. Seelbach" <alseelbach@optonline.net> wrote in message
> news:tAMGe.13138$Kx6.118@fe12.lga...
> > Last week I posted how difficult it is to remove FACTORY installed oil
> > filters. Most post repliers, except for Jim Warman, didn't seem to
> > understand my post and tried to help me install a new filter (oil

gasket,
> > hand tighten, etc.).
> >
> > Well today I had to remove another FACTORY installed oil filter on my
> > wife's Explorer. What we are dealing with here is a 2005 4.6 Explorer.
> > The filter is a Ford FL 820S. I have a socket that I got from AutoZone
> > that fits the FL 820S perfectly...but it doesn't fit the factory
> > filter...it slips while turning, and this is the 4th time I have
> > experienced this problem.
> >
> > I finally got the filter off since I have quite a bit of experience with
> > these factory installed filters...but not without some blood being shed.
> >
> > My conclusion is that the factory filters ARE NOT FL 820S filters. They
> > are a RCH smaller in diameter of the FL 820S, have NO markings as to

what
> > they really are, and to paraphrase Jim Warman...they were put on by
> > Popeye.
> >
> > Anyhow, I now have both factory filters replaced (I have 2 Explorers)

and
> > subsequent removals will be a snap since I can remove the filters that I
> > install and the removal socket now fits.
> >
> > I am curious if any other folks had this experience.
> >
> > Sorry for the rant.
> >
> > Al in Poughkeepsie, NY
> >

>
>



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