In article <firstname.lastname@example.org>,
> CobraJet wrote:
RAMFM should know that Patrick brought this post over here from the
Big Block group, and it really should have been posted whole to keep it
> > It's nice to see some 20-odd people reply to the Roll Call. However,
> > it seems everyone is just waiting for someone else to post first.
> I never understood this thinking... folks complaining that things are
> dead, yet they're reluctant to post anything. It's like someone
> thinking the conversation at a party sucks, while *they* are sitting in
> a back corner with their mouth shut the whole time.
Sometimes I think people hesitate to post about whatever because
they think it may not be interesting or important. This should not be a
factor, as you cannot second guess another person's opinion.
On the flip side, there have been some really ass-kickin' posts that
received little or no feedback. This attitude creates apathy. If you
liked what someone else had to say, take a moment and say so.
Remember the "old" CobraJet? I wrote stories and offered my brand of
twisted humor in various ways. After a while, I felt that nobody cared,
so I quit. The only way I could get interaction was flaming the snot
out of someone. See how that works?
> > People, take a look through the list of other alt.-hierarchy auto
> > groups. The number of them that are now totally abandoned is
> > considerable. Unless some of you take the initiative to create more
> > talk, we will join their ranks.
> Yep, a NG only lives because of consistent contributions by its
> > I am no longer of the mindset to flog this group into shape by myself.
> > Matter > of fact, I have back-shelved personal auto endeavors until I'm
> > done building > things around here.
> He flogs; I massage.
I'm probably more adept with a whip than you, but I digress.
> > I'm not alone in this concern. Patrick in RAMFM has expressed
> > concern over the steady decline in quality on-topic banter. Even the
> > proliferation of "tech" questions by the same confused individual under
> > a multitude of different nyms is not going to help them or us.
> He's calls me a confused individual... that's okay... I swiped him
> earlier with the term stupid.
I had to laugh at this, sorry. Feeling a bit picked on? As Wound Up
mentioned in the other group, you were not the person I was referring
to. Not even close. Or...
Do you know what a nym is? *Are* you admitting to this?
Me, stupid? Arrogant and calculating at times, maybe.
> > I know Patrick tries hard, but sooner or later he has to realize it can't
> > be > a one-man show.
> Thanks, I do try hard. But I've never thought of myself as a one-man
> show. I've only tried to do my part, and hoped others would do theirs.
I entirely understand your efforts, although you must spend an awful
lot of time in the Webside auto sites.
> > One person here needs to take charge and field suggestions for
> > keeping this group alive.
> I see it a little differently. Again, it isn't a one-person job. No
> one person can do it. It takes everyone who reads the NG to keep it
Again, "here" in context is AHPBBFM. I absolutely believe in the
merits of an organizer who can coordinate discussion and ideas.
Obviously, a lone crusader is destined to failure.
Most of the newbies in RAMFM have no reference for comparison. When
I came on board in '98, there were three to four hundred posts a day.
Of course, there was the still the occasional flame war, but enough
on-topic stuff to keep ya hoppin'. I remember "conversations" where I
had to reload this group every few minutes too keep up.
Now, well, if you extract the off-topic crap here, there isn't much
> > It won't be me. If things pick up consistently, I may participate as time
> > permits. Otherwise, I may "see" some of you Webside next year.
> My NG contributions will soon end. I will be checking out later this
> week. I may be back sometime next year. I am a little concerned
> when/if I do come back that there may not be anything to come back to.
> So here's a thought I will leave with the remaining regulars of both
> newsgroups: Between the two newsgroups there is a considerable amount
> of talent and dedication, at least enough to keep one group alive and
> thriving. So I think it may be time to merge the two groups/and their
> regulars back together. Before anyone says this is blasphemy, let me
Physically and ideologically impossible. There are people here who
have no interest in our topics, and people in the BB group who consider
RAMFM an utter waste of time after years of flaming and off-topic shit.
Those who still like both, will post in both. You see Thunder Snakes
here on a regular basis.
> remind you that this particular asshole will not be around to muck
> things up. Let me repeat this, *I* will *not* be around, *at all*. So
I understand you are getting burned out, and there are other things
in life. Today's posts are in fact four months after my last posts, so
My primary criticism in the past of your "news of the hour" approach
was that your headlines were too broad-based, involving cars that are
not even close to the main reason a person looking to join here would
be interested in. There surely must be enough Mustang-related tech and
whatnot out there to post in here instead.
And again, it should not be on *you* to pull this stuff in by
> if I was the, or a, reason you left RAMFM to start AHPBBFM (which is
> probably 90% of the AHPBBFM members), you can take me out of your
Well, don't flatter yourself too much. Although you and I went
around in circles over a couple things, the main reason I formed
AHPBBFM is as I've mentioned several times; there were SO many posts in
here about late models and small blocks that the occasional BB talk got
buried. Plus, for me, the world doesn't revolve around Mustangs. You
know, I have five Torinos and three Cyclones and several even bigger
> equation. The current equation being: is it better to be member of a
> thriving NG, or to one that limps along?
The talk is too different to ever join. In case you missed it, the
main subject of the post you replied to was to upload a revised version
of the AHPBBFM Posting Rules. RAMFM people are far too interested in
non-Mustang happenings to abide by rules, and AHPBBFM guys *generally*
want to stick to the topics listed in the page.
> Now some of you are probably
> thinking what happens "when/if" Patrick comes back. I will tell you
> this. I know the errors of my past. If I come back, I'll will extend
> the olive branch and will be mellowed out. Yes, this will probably be
> hard for me to do, but *I promise* I will be diplomatic for the sake of
> a continued existence in our little corner of Usenet. Now some of you
> might be thinking this is game, a ploy, or a load of BS, but let me
> assure you it is not. I do not play games. This is not a ploy. I do
> not BS. And I do not troll (like some others do). I will be replying
> a few more times in RAMFM, I will send out a final post, and then I
> will be gone. It's just a thought, but I think the time has come...
> can you all come together...? The decision is yours...
The time *has* come for everyone to mellow out, otherwise there
simply will be nothing here. Countless people have exited Usenet over
the years because they could just not stomach the elevated temperatures
for any length of time. In the past, we continued the bickering because
it seemed there would always be sufficient members. Things are
changing. No, they have changed already.
Remember when we used to get trolled by guys who crossposted in from
other groups? Hell, even they are MIA; their home groups are wastelands
now. There are those among us presently that play games of subterfuge
and guile to get their little kicks, aided by members who just cannot
resist egging them on. Some of them even know some things about cars.
What will they do when they are left to talk to themselves? This *IS*
already happening, BTW.
I see it like this. New blood has to create ideas for group projects
and increased membership. The merits of Usenet participation need to be
trotted in front of the Websiders. If you can pull in a fraction of
them, you'd be in good shape. RAMFM (and my group) needs to back off
the negativism towards websites that "illicitly" monitor newsgroups.
None of those guys are getting rich, but they *are* providing an avenue
for recruitment. Wake up, people, it's free advertising. Posting shit
like "Autoforumz sux" just makes us look like kids.
A serious consideration to at least a few basic enforceable rules in
the Mustang group is a must. Again, one of the reasons the Web has
prospered is because some semblance of order exists there. Religion and
politics are the two most incendiary topics anywhere. They have their
place in Usenet; the auto groups ain't it.
Years ago I proposed basic rules and the formation or commandeering
of another newsgroup (by that I mean using one already formed that is
empty) for off-topic yakking. It was turned down. Ironically, most of
the people who objected are no longer posting. See what happens?
I can come up with ideas all day long, being "stupid" and all. But I
refuse to burn up my time implementing them myself. Everyone has to
play, or we can all go Webside.
The two groups cannot "join", but can collaborate on ideas and
tactics. The overt and covert Trolls need to grow up or be frozen
completely. For me, I will see what happens over the next two weeks.
Patrick, I can't tell you what to do, but I advise against shutting the
door entirely unless you see continued apathy.
I am crossposting this in violation of the rules I wrote due to its
importance and topic matter. For those of you in RAMFM interested in
these rules, the new version is here:
> '93 Cobra