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Old 03-18-2005, 16:01   #1 (permalink)
Thomas Cameron
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How big can I go in my 1968 Mustang?

I am thinking of putting a big-block engine in my 1968 Mustang. If I go
with a 429 or 460 do I need to cut anything? Someone I am not sure I
trust said that I needed to relocate the shock towers. That doesn't seem
right since the 1968 came from the factory with a 427 and a 428CJ. Does
anyone know?

Thomas
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Old 03-18-2005, 16:01   #2 (permalink)
Bill S.
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Re: How big can I go in my 1968 Mustang?

You will not have to cut the towers for the 429/460,but you will have to
watch out if your using a C6 transmission, as some of the transmission
housings have ribs along the top that you will need to dimple the bottom
of the firewall for clearance. Hooker used to make a header for this
application, not sure if they are still available.

TS#15

Thomas Cameron wrote:
> I am thinking of putting a big-block engine in my 1968 Mustang. If I go
> with a 429 or 460 do I need to cut anything? Someone I am not sure I
> trust said that I needed to relocate the shock towers. That doesn't seem
> right since the 1968 came from the factory with a 427 and a 428CJ. Does
> anyone know?
>
> Thomas

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Old 03-18-2005, 17:01   #3 (permalink)
one80out@hotmail.com
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Re: How big can I go in my 1968 Mustang?

The 429/460 is a different engine than the 427/428. It's bigger on the
outside.

You can get a kit to make a 460 fit in a '68 without trimming the shock
towers. Go here: www.mpgheads.com. Click the "MPG Catalog" button,
then click the "MPG Motor Mount/Header" link. For $750, or $975 for
ceramic coating on the headers, you get swap headers and motor mounts.
MPG says the kit works "as is" with a C4 or C6, but a stick tranny
requires customer mods. A Mustang magazine write up on this kit when
it first came out said it mounts the engine higher and further forward
than a 428 would be, and opined that this could not be good for braking
or handling.

180 Out
TS 2

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Old 03-31-2005, 13:01   #4 (permalink)
Thomas Cameron
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Re: How big can I go in my 1968 Mustang?

<one80out@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1111191523.373709.192320@l41g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
> The 429/460 is a different engine than the 427/428. It's bigger on the
> outside.
>
> You can get a kit to make a 460 fit in a '68 without trimming the shock
> towers. Go here: www.mpgheads.com. Click the "MPG Catalog" button,
> then click the "MPG Motor Mount/Header" link. For $750, or $975 for
> ceramic coating on the headers, you get swap headers and motor mounts.
> MPG says the kit works "as is" with a C4 or C6, but a stick tranny
> requires customer mods. A Mustang magazine write up on this kit when
> it first came out said it mounts the engine higher and further forward
> than a 428 would be, and opined that this could not be good for braking
> or handling.
>
> 180 Out
> TS 2


OK, so I'm going back and forth on what engine I want to use. I found a
newly rebuilt 428CJ long block for about $2500 at a shop that has a pretty
good reputation. Is that a good price? I assume that would be easier to
get into the 1968 Mustang coupe than a 429/460, right? It's also supposed
to be a really badass engine, isn't it?

Thanks for dealing with all the newbie questions...

Thomas


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Old 03-31-2005, 15:01   #5 (permalink)
one80out@hotmail.com
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Re: How big can I go in my 1968 Mustang?

Thomas C wrote:

> OK, so I'm going back and forth on what
> engine I want to use. áI found a
> newly rebuilt 428CJ long block for
> about $2500 at a shop that has a pretty
> good reputation. áIs that a good price?


That would be a great price.

>áI assume that would be easier to
> get into the 1968 Mustang coupe
> than a 429/460, right?


Yes. It was a factory option.

> It's also supposed
> to be a really badass engine, isn't it?


Here's a link to a post to a web-based forum with a dyno sheet on a
close to stock 428 CJ, showing about 385 hp:

http://www.network54.com/Forum/messa...eid=1111759570

Check this thread for further details:
http://groups-beta.google.com/group/...b7637593ff5cb7

180 Out

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Old 03-31-2005, 16:01   #6 (permalink)
CobraJet
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Re: How big can I go in my 1968 Mustang?

In article <0UY2e.14683$1H3.6574@tornado.texas.rr.com>, Thomas Cameron
<thomas.cameron@camerontech.com> wrote:

> <one80out@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:1111191523.373709.192320@l41g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
> > The 429/460 is a different engine than the 427/428. It's bigger on the
> > outside.
> >
> > You can get a kit to make a 460 fit in a '68 without trimming the shock
> > towers. Go here: www.mpgheads.com. Click the "MPG Catalog" button,
> > then click the "MPG Motor Mount/Header" link. For $750, or $975 for
> > ceramic coating on the headers, you get swap headers and motor mounts.
> > MPG says the kit works "as is" with a C4 or C6, but a stick tranny
> > requires customer mods. A Mustang magazine write up on this kit when
> > it first came out said it mounts the engine higher and further forward
> > than a 428 would be, and opined that this could not be good for braking
> > or handling.
> >
> > 180 Out
> > TS 2

>
> OK, so I'm going back and forth on what engine I want to use. I found a
> newly rebuilt 428CJ long block for about $2500 at a shop that has a pretty
> good reputation. Is that a good price? I assume that would be easier to
> get into the 1968 Mustang coupe than a 429/460, right? It's also supposed
> to be a really badass engine, isn't it?


The trick here is to make sure *all* the parts are actually CJ
pieces. Crank, rods, piston type, heads, block, oil filter adapter are
all CJ-specific. See the details here, and then cross-examine the shop.

http://www.428cobrajet.com/id-main.html

>
> Thanks for dealing with all the newbie questions...


You need to budget out the rest of the parts involved in a BB swap,
as they can add up in a hurry.

CobraJet

>
> Thomas
>
>


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Old 03-31-2005, 18:01   #7 (permalink)
Thomas Cameron
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Re: How big can I go in my 1968 Mustang?

On Thu, 31 Mar 2005 16:01:26 -0700, CobraJet wrote:

> In article <0UY2e.14683$1H3.6574@tornado.texas.rr.com>, Thomas Cameron
>
> The trick here is to make sure *all* the parts are actually CJ
> pieces. Crank, rods, piston type, heads, block, oil filter adapter are
> all CJ-specific. See the details here, and then cross-examine the shop.
>
> http://www.428cobrajet.com/id-main.html


Wow, very good information, thanks. So it is possible that they used a CJ
block then cheap crank, rods, pistons, etc., and I might really not see
any benefit, huh?

>>
>> Thanks for dealing with all the newbie questions...

>
> You need to budget out the rest of the parts involved in a BB swap,
> as they can add up in a hurry.


Yeah, I'm noticing that... I actually have a decent pile (not
outrageous, but decent) set aside for this car, so I want to do it right.

Thomas
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Old 03-31-2005, 18:01   #8 (permalink)
Thomas Cameron
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Re: How big can I go in my 1968 Mustang?

On Thu, 31 Mar 2005 14:41:09 -0800, one80out wrote:

> Thomas C wrote:
>
>> OK, so I'm going back and forth on what
>> engine I want to use. áI found a
>> newly rebuilt 428CJ long block for
>> about $2500 at a shop that has a pretty
>> good reputation. áIs that a good price?

>
> That would be a great price.


Assuming that it is a real CJ through-and-through... What (if anything)
should I be willing to settle on? In other words, if he says "well, when
we rebuilt it we used X rods and Y pistons," what are the big red flags I
should watch out for?

>>áI assume that would be easier to
>> get into the 1968 Mustang coupe
>> than a 429/460, right?

>
> Yes. It was a factory option.
>
>> It's also supposed
>> to be a really badass engine, isn't it?

>
> Here's a link to a post to a web-based forum with a dyno sheet on a
> close to stock 428 CJ, showing about 385 hp:
>
> http://www.network54.com/Forum/messa...eid=1111759570
>
> Check this thread for further details:
> http://groups-beta.google.com/group/...b7637593ff5cb7
>
> 180 Out


Yeah, seems like this is a pretty monster engine. Since it's probably not
original, I could fairly reasonably put a good intake and carb on, some
good headers, good cam and come up with some pretty decent horsepower
without sacrificing too much on reliability... Am I right?

Thomas
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Old 03-31-2005, 19:01   #9 (permalink)
CobraJet
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Posts: n/a
Re: How big can I go in my 1968 Mustang?

In article <pan.2005.04.01.01.42.37.399424@camerontech.com>, Thomas
Cameron <thomas.cameron@camerontech.com> wrote:

> On Thu, 31 Mar 2005 16:01:26 -0700, CobraJet wrote:
>
> > In article <0UY2e.14683$1H3.6574@tornado.texas.rr.com>, Thomas Cameron
> >
> > The trick here is to make sure *all* the parts are actually CJ
> > pieces. Crank, rods, piston type, heads, block, oil filter adapter are
> > all CJ-specific. See the details here, and then cross-examine the shop.
> >
> > http://www.428cobrajet.com/id-main.html

>
> Wow, very good information, thanks. So it is possible that they used a CJ
> block then cheap crank, rods, pistons, etc., and I might really not see
> any benefit, huh?


Well it gets involved, and it depends on what you are going to do
with the car. However, what makes power in the CJ is the head design.
The block and rods were designed to take more of a beating than regular
parts. The stock compression ratio is 10.65:1, so you need to know if
exact replacements were used, or something more pump gas friendly. If
it is stock compression, then you need to tailor the cam to run pump
gas. You need to find out what cam and valve spring setup is in that
engine.

I suggest getting all the specs you can, including casting numbers,
and take it from there. You are going to need the oil pan off to check
the crank, rods and block.

>
> >>
> >> Thanks for dealing with all the newbie questions...

> >
> > You need to budget out the rest of the parts involved in a BB swap,
> > as they can add up in a hurry.

>
> Yeah, I'm noticing that... I actually have a decent pile (not
> outrageous, but decent) set aside for this car, so I want to do it right.


What do you have so far?

>
> Thomas


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Old 03-31-2005, 19:01   #10 (permalink)
CobraJet
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Posts: n/a
Re: How big can I go in my 1968 Mustang?

In article <pan.2005.04.01.01.45.10.72247@camerontech.com>, Thomas
Cameron <thomas.cameron@camerontech.com> wrote:

> On Thu, 31 Mar 2005 14:41:09 -0800, one80out wrote:
>
> > Thomas C wrote:
> >
> >> OK, so I'm going back and forth on what
> >> engine I want to use. áI found a
> >> newly rebuilt 428CJ long block for
> >> about $2500 at a shop that has a pretty
> >> good reputation. áIs that a good price?

> >
> > That would be a great price.

>
> Assuming that it is a real CJ through-and-through... What (if anything)
> should I be willing to settle on? In other words, if he says "well, when
> we rebuilt it we used X rods and Y pistons," what are the big red flags I
> should watch out for?
>
> >>áI assume that would be easier to
> >> get into the 1968 Mustang coupe
> >> than a 429/460, right?

> >
> > Yes. It was a factory option.
> >
> >> It's also supposed
> >> to be a really badass engine, isn't it?

> >
> > Here's a link to a post to a web-based forum with a dyno sheet on a
> > close to stock 428 CJ, showing about 385 hp:
> >
> > http://www.network54.com/Forum/messa...eid=1111759570
> >
> > Check this thread for further details:
> >
> > http://groups-beta.google.com/group/...ercury/browse_
> > frm/thread/cc79e6067d7fce6d/32b7637593ff5cb7#32b7637593ff5cb7
> >
> > 180 Out

>
> Yeah, seems like this is a pretty monster engine. Since it's probably not
> original, I could fairly reasonably put a good intake and carb on, some
> good headers, good cam and come up with some pretty decent horsepower
> without sacrificing too much on reliability... Am I right?


The neat thing about CJ's is that they are big torque with mild
manners. A dead stock one will put you deep into the 13's with 389
gears and sticky tires in your car.

>
> Thomas


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