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Old 10-17-2005, 11:01   #1 (permalink)
Geronimo
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One more ? on 89 740 GL....

(see my post below this one)

I think the timing has also jumped off. Has happened before after
repeated heavy cranking from other problems. Problem is, the harmonic
balancer was replaced, and I cannot see any mark/notch or dot on it.
Don't see a notch on the crankshaft sprocket (behind damper) either!
Neither is there any kind of +/- 0-degree index to reference a notch
to! On the cam sprocket, there is no problem. The dot that you line up
with the 11 o'clock mark on the upper rear of the timing belt cover
is clearly visible.
I noticed that the cam sprocket has points, two I think, going
through 360 degress......that it just wants to "drop" into, seems like
these points are at 11 o'clock and 5 o'clock.

The Haynes manual shows that when timed correctly, the cam is at
abt. 11 o'clock, and the crankshaft/damper pulley notch is also at
abt. 11 o'clock. But with no reference on damper pulley, I can't do
the procedure called for in the Haynes manual... I guess all I can do
is take the no 1 spark plug out and use a screwdriver to feel when the
piston is at TDC. Will I be able to get it timed well enough this way?
Or will I still need to get it tweaked exactly right by a pro?
Thanks for the help....Jim


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Old 10-17-2005, 12:01   #2 (permalink)
Randy G.
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Re: One more ? on 89 740 GL....

Geronimo <someone@somewhere.net> wrote:

>(see my post below this one)
>
> I think the timing has also jumped off. Has happened before after
>repeated heavy cranking from other problems. Problem is, the harmonic
>balancer was replaced, and I cannot see any mark/notch or dot on it.
>Don't see a notch on the crankshaft sprocket (behind damper) either!
>Neither is there any kind of +/- 0-degree index to reference a notch
>to! On the cam sprocket, there is no problem. The dot that you line up
>with the 11 o'clock mark on the upper rear of the timing belt cover
>is clearly visible.
> I noticed that the cam sprocket has points, two I think, going
>through 360 degress......that it just wants to "drop" into, seems like
>these points are at 11 o'clock and 5 o'clock.
>
> The Haynes manual shows that when timed correctly, the cam is at
>abt. 11 o'clock, and the crankshaft/damper pulley notch is also at
>abt. 11 o'clock. But with no reference on damper pulley, I can't do
>the procedure called for in the Haynes manual... I guess all I can do
>is take the no 1 spark plug out and use a screwdriver to feel when the
>piston is at TDC. Will I be able to get it timed well enough this way?
>Or will I still need to get it tweaked exactly right by a pro?
> Thanks for the help....Jim
>



Pull all the plugs and put your finger over the #1 spark plug hole.
You will feel it come up on compression while manually turning the
crank pulley. Use a wooden dowel, plastic rod, or other similar tool
to feel when the piston is all the way up. Do not use a metal tool
becasue if you cause any scratches on the piston, the metal burr can
cause preigition detonation (ping and knock).

To find TDC exactly, turn the motor back to where you feel the piston
go down a bit. mark this position on the pulley. Rotate it in the
opposite direction and feel where it begins to go down a bit. Mark
that position. Midway between the two marks should be poretty darn
close to TDC. Mark the balancer with a scribe along a convenient place
that aligns with a mark on the motor.

You know the rest...



__ __
Randy & \ \/ /alerie's
\__/olvos
'90 245 Estate - '93 965 Estate
"Shelby" & "Kate"
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Old 10-18-2005, 08:01   #3 (permalink)
Geronimo
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Re: One more ? on 89 740 GL....




I am still a little unclear on this. If I line up the cam sprocket
index dots at their 11 o'clock position, and then find exact TDC as
you said to do, this gaurantees that it is set up for TDC on the
compression stroke, not exhaust stroke (as confirmed by air pressure
building up against the fingertip)?

On Mon, 17 Oct 2005 11:08:55 -0700, "Randy G."
<frcn@DESPAMMOcncnet.com> wrote:

>Geronimo <someone@somewhere.net> wrote:
>
>>(see my post below this one)
>>
>> I think the timing has also jumped off. Has happened before after
>>repeated heavy cranking from other problems. Problem is, the harmonic
>>balancer was replaced, and I cannot see any mark/notch or dot on it.
>>Don't see a notch on the crankshaft sprocket (behind damper) either!
>>Neither is there any kind of +/- 0-degree index to reference a notch
>>to! On the cam sprocket, there is no problem. The dot that you line up
>>with the 11 o'clock mark on the upper rear of the timing belt cover
>>is clearly visible.
>> I noticed that the cam sprocket has points, two I think, going
>>through 360 degress......that it just wants to "drop" into, seems like
>>these points are at 11 o'clock and 5 o'clock.
>>
>> The Haynes manual shows that when timed correctly, the cam is at
>>abt. 11 o'clock, and the crankshaft/damper pulley notch is also at
>>abt. 11 o'clock. But with no reference on damper pulley, I can't do
>>the procedure called for in the Haynes manual... I guess all I can do
>>is take the no 1 spark plug out and use a screwdriver to feel when the
>>piston is at TDC. Will I be able to get it timed well enough this way?
>>Or will I still need to get it tweaked exactly right by a pro?
>> Thanks for the help....Jim
>>

>
>
>Pull all the plugs and put your finger over the #1 spark plug hole.
>You will feel it come up on compression while manually turning the
>crank pulley. Use a wooden dowel, plastic rod, or other similar tool
>to feel when the piston is all the way up. Do not use a metal tool
>becasue if you cause any scratches on the piston, the metal burr can
>cause preigition detonation (ping and knock).
>
>To find TDC exactly, turn the motor back to where you feel the piston
>go down a bit. mark this position on the pulley. Rotate it in the
>opposite direction and feel where it begins to go down a bit. Mark
>that position. Midway between the two marks should be poretty darn
>close to TDC. Mark the balancer with a scribe along a convenient place
>that aligns with a mark on the motor.
>
>You know the rest...
>
>
>
> __ __
> Randy & \ \/ /alerie's
> \__/olvos
>'90 245 Estate - '93 965 Estate
> "Shelby" & "Kate"


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Old 10-18-2005, 14:01   #4 (permalink)
User
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Posts: n/a
Re: One more ? on 89 740 GL....

In article <mqv9l1d9p5r5oe4r91joho4t3c2rm9ohh7@4ax.com>,
someone@somewhere.net says...
>
>
>
> I am still a little unclear on this. If I line up the cam sprocket
> index dots at their 11 o'clock position, and then find exact TDC as
> you said to do, this gaurantees that it is set up for TDC on the
> compression stroke, not exhaust stroke (as confirmed by air pressure
> building up against the fingertip)?
>
> On Mon, 17 Oct 2005 11:08:55 -0700, "Randy G."
> <frcn@DESPAMMOcncnet.com> wrote:
>
> >Geronimo <someone@somewhere.net> wrote:
> >

The outer guard sheave on the crankshaft wheel has a notch that aligns
with the protruded index line on the front of the engine. The dot on the
camshaft aligns with a notch cut in the front of the cam cover. If your
distributor is in the back of the head the dot on the jack shaft pulley
is irrelevant otherwise use the single line markings on the new belt to
stablish the correct location.

Install the belt starting at the crankshaft, around the jackshaft and
around the camshaft so that all the slack is on the tensioner side.
Slacken the nut on the tensioner and pry it against the spring all the
way to the loosest position and tighen the nut (Probably shuld be the
first step). Use a clothes pin clamp to hold ther belt stationary on the
cam wheel and slide the belt over the tensioner pulley. Loosen the nut
and let the the tensioner find its own center. Tighten the nut. Check
your timing marks for proper alignment. Install the crank bolt and turn
the motor through 2 or four revolutions to be sure nothing is binding.
Inspect the timing mark alignment one more time. If there was too much
slack on the left side of the motor (right side as you face it) the
tensioner will pull the crank pulley clockwise as you face the motor and
your marks won't line up.

In four cylinder history, motors set up with the crank on TDC and the
mark on the cam gear or sprocket if a chain driven motor facing each
other. This would be #4 compression/firing. But when you put the mark on
top, since the pulleys are relatively far apart using this method is
difficult, so a mark was placed topside to facilitate set up. In order
to do this the motor had to be turned another 180 degrees to put the cam
mark at the top, hence the motor sets up on #1 compression/firing. I
haven't ever seen a bentley manual so I don't know what they are talking
about with 11 o'clock and such. The marks make a straight run down the
center line of the motor.

So I guess the short answer to your question is, "yes."

Bob
--
The goal when driving is to miss the maximum number of objects.
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Old 10-18-2005, 20:01   #5 (permalink)
James Sweet
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Posts: n/a
Re: One more ? on 89 740 GL....


"Geronimo" <someone@somewhere.net> wrote in message
news:mqv9l1d9p5r5oe4r91joho4t3c2rm9ohh7@4ax.com...
>
>
>
> I am still a little unclear on this. If I line up the cam sprocket
> index dots at their 11 o'clock position, and then find exact TDC as
> you said to do, this gaurantees that it is set up for TDC on the
> compression stroke, not exhaust stroke (as confirmed by air pressure
> building up against the fingertip)?
>



The compression stroke and the exhaust stroke are identical as far as the
crankshaft is concerned, so long as you line up the rotor in the distributor
correctly you'll be fine.


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