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Old 11-27-2005, 03:01   #1 (permalink)
Alex
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Corrieyairack Pass, Scotland

Does anybody know if it's still possible to drive the General Wade
Miitary Road from Garva Bridge to Fort Augustus, across the mountains
thru the Corrieyairack Pass? (legally possible, not physically)


TIA

Alex
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Old 11-27-2005, 04:01   #2 (permalink)
MVP
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Re: Corrieyairack Pass, Scotland

On Sun, 27 Nov 2005 10:23:27 +0000, Alex <nospam.alex@cbmsys.co.uk>
wrote:

>Does anybody know if it's still possible to drive the General Wade
>Miitary Road from Garva Bridge to Fort Augustus, across the mountains
>thru the Corrieyairack Pass? (legally possible, not physically)
>
>
>TIA
>
>Alex


there was an article in one of the comics a few months ago, IIRC one
end of it is blocked and you have to turn around and go back,
deliberate obstruction of some kind..

--
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Old 11-27-2005, 16:01   #3 (permalink)
tommg@gotadsl.co.uk
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Re: Corrieyairack Pass, Scotland

Hi

The club i'm in (Highland 4 Wheel Drive Club) did an organised run from
Fort Augustus to the summit and back in April to raise money for
charity. From what I understand the Fort Augustus side is usually
closed and advance permission is required from the landowner, as far as
i know the Laggan side is open although when we were there the
switchback east of the summit was badly washed out and in need of
repair, at the time i don't think it would be driveable (uphill) in a
standard 4x4.
I don't know if the situation has changed since.

Hope this helps,
Tom

http://www.highland4wheeldriveclub.co.uk/

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Old 12-07-2005, 15:01   #4 (permalink)
Martyn Asker
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Re: Corrieyairack Pass, Scotland

The road at the Fort Augustus end has a locked gate

Regards Martyn

In article <342jo1ls3t7qahdcahr17p47q823tms34p@4ax.com>, Alex
<nospam.alex@cbmsys.co.uk> wrote:
>Does anybody know if it's still possible to drive the General Wade
>Miitary Road from Garva Bridge to Fort Augustus, across the mountains
>thru the Corrieyairack Pass? (legally possible, not physically)
>
>
>TIA
>
>Alex

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Old 12-07-2005, 16:01   #5 (permalink)
Andrew Kay
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Re: Corrieyairack Pass, Scotland


"Martyn Asker" <martyn.asker@zetnet.co.uk> wrote in message
news:43976493$0$5853$4c56ba96@master.news.zetnet.net...
>
> In article <342jo1ls3t7qahdcahr17p47q823tms34p@4ax.com>, Alex
> <nospam.alex@cbmsys.co.uk> wrote:
>>Does anybody know if it's still possible to drive the General Wade
>>Miitary Road from Garva Bridge to Fort Augustus, across the mountains
>>thru the Corrieyairack Pass? (legally possible, not physically)


> The road at the Fort Augustus end has a locked gate


There is also a fence across it with only a pedestrian size gap in it and if
you look carefully, the steel poles are still set into the road, behind the
fence. See: http://www.sorc.org.uk/sorc/outings/...ie/CP19JSP.jpg and
http://www.sorc.org.uk/sorc/outings/jpcorrie/page1.htm

Cheers
Andrew


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Old 12-08-2005, 00:01   #6 (permalink)
Austin Shackles
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Posts: n/a
Re: Corrieyairack Pass, Scotland

On or around Wed, 7 Dec 2005 23:48:59 -0000, "Andrew Kay"
<andrew@NOSPAMkay5juniperDOTfsnet.co.uk> enlightened us thusly:

>
>"Martyn Asker" <martyn.asker@zetnet.co.uk> wrote in message
>news:43976493$0$5853$4c56ba96@master.news.zetnet.net...
>>
>> In article <342jo1ls3t7qahdcahr17p47q823tms34p@4ax.com>, Alex
>> <nospam.alex@cbmsys.co.uk> wrote:
>>>Does anybody know if it's still possible to drive the General Wade
>>>Miitary Road from Garva Bridge to Fort Augustus, across the mountains
>>>thru the Corrieyairack Pass? (legally possible, not physically)

>
>> The road at the Fort Augustus end has a locked gate

>
>There is also a fence across it with only a pedestrian size gap in it and if
>you look carefully, the steel poles are still set into the road, behind the
>fence. See: http://www.sorc.org.uk/sorc/outings/...ie/CP19JSP.jpg and
>http://www.sorc.org.uk/sorc/outings/jpcorrie/page1.htm


So what's the legal position WRT vehicular right of way on it? None of the
pictures on that site show a track which is going to be damaged by
reasonable use, I'd say.


--
Austin Shackles. www.ddol-las.net my opinions are just that
Soon shall thy arm, unconquered steam! afar Drag the slow barge, or
drive the rapid car; Or on wide-waving wings expanded bear the
flying chariot through the field of air.- Erasmus Darwin (1731-1802)
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Old 12-08-2005, 01:01   #7 (permalink)
beamendsltd
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Posts: n/a
Re: Corrieyairack Pass, Scotland

In message <g1ofp1ll5ptbmg58lgso7ksj1rnb3kem4a@4ax.com>
Austin Shackles <austinNOSPAM@ddol-las.net> wrote:

> On or around Wed, 7 Dec 2005 23:48:59 -0000, "Andrew Kay"
> <andrew@NOSPAMkay5juniperDOTfsnet.co.uk> enlightened us thusly:
>
> >
> >"Martyn Asker" <martyn.asker@zetnet.co.uk> wrote in message
> >news:43976493$0$5853$4c56ba96@master.news.zetnet.net...
> >>
> >> In article <342jo1ls3t7qahdcahr17p47q823tms34p@4ax.com>, Alex
> >> <nospam.alex@cbmsys.co.uk> wrote:
> >>>Does anybody know if it's still possible to drive the General Wade
> >>>Miitary Road from Garva Bridge to Fort Augustus, across the mountains
> >>>thru the Corrieyairack Pass? (legally possible, not physically)

> >
> >> The road at the Fort Augustus end has a locked gate

> >
> >There is also a fence across it with only a pedestrian size gap in it and if
> >you look carefully, the steel poles are still set into the road, behind the
> >fence. See: http://www.sorc.org.uk/sorc/outings/...ie/CP19JSP.jpg and
> >http://www.sorc.org.uk/sorc/outings/jpcorrie/page1.htm

>
> So what's the legal position WRT vehicular right of way on it? None of the
> pictures on that site show a track which is going to be damaged by
> reasonable use, I'd say.
>
>


Scottish law on byways is very different to England & Wales. It's
something along the lines of "if you can show use, that makes it a
road" - obvioulsy it's more involved than that but you get the idea.

<apparently>
In England & Wales, if a road is blocked (be it surfaced or otherwise)
then the Highways Dept. is duty bound to keep it clear (whether they
actualy do that or not is another matter. You block any surfaced road
and see how quickly they enforce it compared to an unsurfaced road),
and you have the right to move the obstruction or take reasonable
measures to go round it.

I believe the situation in Scotland is very much more complex, and an
article I read about the Pass suggested that if the bloke keeps it
obstructed for long enough it will be deemed to be no longer used
and he can gat it closed - or something like that.
</apparently>

Richard
--
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Old 12-08-2005, 06:01   #8 (permalink)
Andrew Kay
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Posts: n/a
Re: Corrieyairack Pass, Scotland

"Austin Shackles" <austinNOSPAM@ddol-las.net> wrote in message
news:g1ofp1ll5ptbmg58lgso7ksj1rnb3kem4a@4ax.com...
> On or around Wed, 7 Dec 2005 23:48:59 -0000, "Andrew Kay"
> <andrew@NOSPAMkay5juniperDOTfsnet.co.uk> enlightened us thusly:
>
>>
>>"Martyn Asker" <martyn.asker@zetnet.co.uk> wrote in message
>>news:43976493$0$5853$4c56ba96@master.news.zetnet.net...
>>>
>>> In article <342jo1ls3t7qahdcahr17p47q823tms34p@4ax.com>, Alex
>>> <nospam.alex@cbmsys.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>Does anybody know if it's still possible to drive the General Wade
>>>>Miitary Road from Garva Bridge to Fort Augustus, across the mountains
>>>>thru the Corrieyairack Pass? (legally possible, not physically)

>>
>>> The road at the Fort Augustus end has a locked gate

>>
>>There is also a fence across it with only a pedestrian size gap in it and
>>if
>>you look carefully, the steel poles are still set into the road, behind
>>the
>>fence. See: http://www.sorc.org.uk/sorc/outings/...ie/CP19JSP.jpg
>>and
>>http://www.sorc.org.uk/sorc/outings/jpcorrie/page1.htm

>
> So what's the legal position WRT vehicular right of way on it? None of
> the
> pictures on that site show a track which is going to be damaged by
> reasonable use, I'd say.


1) It is a public right of way of some kind. That isn't in dispute.

2) It is recorded on the Scotways CRoW (Catalogue of Rights of Way), which
is almost a surrogate for the Definitive Maps in England & Wales, as being
of "unknown" status. It is NOT, therefore, proven to be either a footpath
or a bridleway.

3) As it is a *road* (a way with a public right) and is not proven to be a
footpath or a bridleway, I would have thought that a prosecution under s34
of the Road Traffic Act (Scotland) 1988 is unlikely.

4) The Wade road over the Corrieyairack Pass is a scheduled ancient
monument. It is, therefore, an offence to *damage* it. AFAIK, there is no
case law that would support the notion that merely using the route (e.g.
driving on it) is damaging it. One could argue, probably with some force
that the civil works - installation of a gate, steel posts, a fence and
changes to the height and width of the road at the Fort Augustus end
constitutes damage!!! It is certainly a change to the nature of the road
and would, I think, require approval. Some time, I must try and find out
whether the owner of the Culachy Estate did indeed have approval to make
those changes to this scheduled monument.

To summarise, the legal position is at best a bit grey. You don't have a
*proven* right to drive on it - but many folks do. No one, AFAIK, has ever
been prosecuted for driving on it - indeed, it isn't obvious what they might
be prosecuted for.

Cheers
Andrew


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