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Old 03-23-2005, 08:01   #1 (permalink)
Fred Labrosse
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Recovery points

All,

Is it indeed safe to use the towing eyes as recovery points (as was
suggested by the guy who sold the def to me)?

Any better solution?

Cheers,

Fred

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Old 03-23-2005, 10:02   #2 (permalink)
MVP
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Re: Recovery points

On Wed, 23 Mar 2005 15:23:54 +0000, Fred Labrosse <ffl@aber.ac.uk>
wrote:

>All,
>
>Is it indeed safe to use the towing eyes as recovery points (as was
>suggested by the guy who sold the def to me)?
>
>Any better solution?
>
>Cheers,
>
>Fred


assuming defender and assuming he is referring to the pairs of
tie-down eyes (teardrop shaped things bolted to the chassis) then you
can use them for recovery/towing but I'd consider it emergency only
and only ever in pairs using a bridle.
if you indend needing to be recovered often I'd buy a pair of jate
rings and again use them as a pair with a bridle.


Regards.
Mark.(AKA, Mr.Nice.)
--
_________________________________________
1984 110 CSW 2.5(na)D
(3,000 rivets flying in close formation)
www.4x4info.info
www.mvp-fine-art.co.uk
www.markvarleyphoto.co.uk
_________________________________________



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Old 03-23-2005, 11:02   #3 (permalink)
Austin Shackles
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Re: Recovery points

On or around Wed, 23 Mar 2005 15:23:54 +0000, Fred Labrosse <ffl@aber.ac.uk>
enlightened us thusly:

>All,
>
>Is it indeed safe to use the towing eyes as recovery points (as was
>suggested by the guy who sold the def to me)?


they're OK for occasional pull-out-of ditch style duty. They're not really
towing eyes.

they're not safe for recovery from deep sticky mud, winching up
near-vertical banks and they're very-not-safe for such advanced stuff as
snatch recovery with a KERR - that puts very big loads on all the gear,
including the chassis. Mind you, I've seen people get away with 2 KERRs
knotted together...
>
>Any better solution?


buy proper recovery points or jate rings and fit 'em. Scorpion, Bearmach
etc. sell 'em.

Same applies (only less so) to using tow balls as recovery attachments. The
tow ball is stronger than the lashing eyes, but isn't truly safe - typically
designed for a 3500Kg maximum tow, but to get 3500Kg on the ball you have to
for example decelerate a 3500Kg trailer at 1G with no trailer brakes, or
have it hanging from the ball off a cliff (seen a picture of such, mind...).
I don't know what the failure stress on tow balls is, but there are records
of them being broken, and the ball doing a credible impression of a 2"
cannonball.
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Old 03-25-2005, 05:02   #4 (permalink)
AJG
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Re: Recovery points

In message <1111591429.519541@leri.aber.ac.uk>, Fred Labrosse
<ffl@aber.ac.uk> writes
>All,
>
>Is it indeed safe to use the towing eyes as recovery points (as was
>suggested by the guy who sold the def to me)?
>

I've seen recovery points sheer ... not nice as they project themselves
either through or over the recovery vehicle! Tie downs will probably
hold on an absolutely straight pull but apply any side-stress and watch
them fly!

If *you are being recovered* by all means use them if you must, if *I
was recovering you* from anything other then a simple pull along a grass
verge I'd avoid them!

>Any better solution?

as said elsewhere, JATE rings are best

--
AndyG
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Old 03-25-2005, 07:01   #5 (permalink)
Dave White
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Re: Recovery points

In <Twn85zGxX$QCFwif@shedcity.demon.co.uk> AJG wrote:
> In message <1111591429.519541@leri.aber.ac.uk>, Fred Labrosse
> <ffl@aber.ac.uk> writes
>>All,
>>
>>Is it indeed safe to use the towing eyes as recovery points (as was
>>suggested by the guy who sold the def to me)?
>>

> I've seen recovery points sheer ... not nice as they project
> themselves either through or over the recovery vehicle! Tie downs
> will probably hold on an absolutely straight pull but apply any side-
> stress and watch them fly!
>
> If *you are being recovered* by all means use them if you must, if *I
> was recovering you* from anything other then a simple pull along a
> grass verge I'd avoid them!


It's worth adding that IF you do use them then always use them with a
shackle if you want to use your rope/strap again. The lash down eyes
will rotate forwards and make a wonderful scissor action with the
chassis. The downside of using a shackle being that if something does
give then the shackle adds extra mass to the lump of metal flying
towards the recovery vehicle.

cheers

Dave W.
http://www.yorkshireoffroadclub.net/vehicles/bgs/
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Old 03-28-2005, 06:01   #6 (permalink)
Kieran Turner
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Posts: n/a
Re: Recovery points

"Austin Shackles" <austinNOSPAM@ddol-las.net> wrote in message
news:ara341t2ubdbbv1i2vuem34ta6ioe8n1me@4ax.com...
>>
>>Is it indeed safe to use the towing eyes as recovery points (as was
>>suggested by the guy who sold the def to me)?

>
> Same applies (only less so) to using tow balls as recovery attachments.
> The
> tow ball is stronger than the lashing eyes, but isn't truly safe -
> typically
> designed for a 3500Kg maximum tow, but to get 3500Kg on the ball you have
> to
> for example decelerate a 3500Kg trailer at 1G with no trailer brakes, or
> have it hanging from the ball off a cliff (seen a picture of such,
> mind...).
> I don't know what the failure stress on tow balls is, but there are
> records
> of them being broken, and the ball doing a credible impression of a 2"
> cannonball.


And watch out for how they're attached. One of my colleagues recently had a
problem with his trailer which caused it to snatch and bang on the ball
rather badly on the way home from a trip across Europe. With no reasonable
prospect of getting the trailer serviced before we got home, he just put up
with it.

After about 1500 miles like that, we noticed to our horror that the bolts
holding the tow-ball onto the Disco were bent and almost sheared off.

They turned out to be of totally the wrong grade of steel. "M4.5" if I
remember rightly instead of - and somebody will correct me here if my memory
is failing - M8, toughened steel.

If you didn't fit your own tow-ball then this is a mistake you too could be
living with. I checked mine, and also carry a spare set of strong nuts &
bolts now just in case - the local trailer dealer (Trident) gave me them
free when I hired a trailer from them, since they seemed to like my level of
responsibility

K


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Old 03-30-2005, 14:02   #7 (permalink)
Richard
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Posts: n/a
Re: Recovery points

Trident trailers Maidstone ?
Richard



"Kieran Turner" <kieran@SPAMTRAP.kemptown.org> wrote in message
news:4248082f$0$83066$ed2619ec@ptn-nntp-reader03.plus.net...
> "Austin Shackles" <austinNOSPAM@ddol-las.net> wrote in message
> news:ara341t2ubdbbv1i2vuem34ta6ioe8n1me@4ax.com...
>>>
>>>Is it indeed safe to use the towing eyes as recovery points (as was
>>>suggested by the guy who sold the def to me)?

>>
>> Same applies (only less so) to using tow balls as recovery attachments.
>> The
>> tow ball is stronger than the lashing eyes, but isn't truly safe -
>> typically
>> designed for a 3500Kg maximum tow, but to get 3500Kg on the ball you have
>> to
>> for example decelerate a 3500Kg trailer at 1G with no trailer brakes, or
>> have it hanging from the ball off a cliff (seen a picture of such,
>> mind...).
>> I don't know what the failure stress on tow balls is, but there are
>> records
>> of them being broken, and the ball doing a credible impression of a 2"
>> cannonball.

>
> And watch out for how they're attached. One of my colleagues recently had
> a problem with his trailer which caused it to snatch and bang on the ball
> rather badly on the way home from a trip across Europe. With no reasonable
> prospect of getting the trailer serviced before we got home, he just put
> up with it.
>
> After about 1500 miles like that, we noticed to our horror that the bolts
> holding the tow-ball onto the Disco were bent and almost sheared off.
>
> They turned out to be of totally the wrong grade of steel. "M4.5" if I
> remember rightly instead of - and somebody will correct me here if my
> memory is failing - M8, toughened steel.
>
> If you didn't fit your own tow-ball then this is a mistake you too could
> be living with. I checked mine, and also carry a spare set of strong nuts
> & bolts now just in case - the local trailer dealer (Trident) gave me them
> free when I hired a trailer from them, since they seemed to like my level
> of responsibility
>
> K
>



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