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Old 09-08-2005, 00:01   #1 (permalink)
MichaelT
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Zeus timing gear conversions?

Developed to overcome the Tdi belt problems in the 1990s, Zeus claim large
sales, but I cannot find any user experiences etc. There was a user
installation guide published in LRO in 1999 I understand. Anyone really
using them? Is there any improvement in economy? Are they noisy? Given that
belts need replacement at 60,000k (40,000 miles) how well do they last?

Michael T


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Old 09-08-2005, 00:01   #2 (permalink)
Pantelis Giamarellos
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Re: Zeus timing gear conversions?

Michael Hi,

this may be of assistance
http://www.rovingtheglobe.com/defaul.../Equipment/Veh
icles/Technical/Obsolete/ZeusTimingGears/Introduction.asp

It is a negative experience but it did make me have second thoughts about
this conversion.

Take care
Pantelis

"MichaelT" <michaelt@thomzone.com> wrote in message
news:0rQTe.26202$FA3.17308@news-server.bigpond.net.au...
> Developed to overcome the Tdi belt problems in the 1990s, Zeus claim large
> sales, but I cannot find any user experiences etc. There was a user
> installation guide published in LRO in 1999 I understand. Anyone really
> using them? Is there any improvement in economy? Are they noisy? Given

that
> belts need replacement at 60,000k (40,000 miles) how well do they last?
>
> Michael T
>
>



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Old 09-08-2005, 00:01   #3 (permalink)
Richard Brookman
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Re: Zeus timing gear conversions?

so MichaelT was, like...
> Developed to overcome the Tdi belt problems in the 1990s, Zeus claim
> large sales, but I cannot find any user experiences etc. There was a
> user installation guide published in LRO in 1999 I understand. Anyone
> really using them? Is there any improvement in economy? Are they
> noisy? Given that belts need replacement at 60,000k (40,000 miles)
> how well do they last?
> Michael T


Google it, especially on this group - there was quite a discussion a while
ago. Some very much for, some against. A summary, as I recall it -
noisier, stays in tune better, slight improvement in economy, early problems
with plastic gears later solved, very expensive, not a good idea for
expedition vehicles as parts not easily available world-wide if it does go
wrong. The guy who was importing them to (I think) Oz had a lot to say, all
in favour as you might imagine.

Plenty to read if you look for it.

--
Rich
==============================
Disco 300 Tdi auto
S2a 88" SW
Tiggrr (V8 trialler)


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Old 09-08-2005, 02:01   #4 (permalink)
A
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Re: Zeus timing gear conversions?


"MichaelT" <michaelt@thomzone.com> wrote in message
news:0rQTe.26202$FA3.17308@news-server.bigpond.net.au...
> Developed to overcome the Tdi belt problems in the 1990s, Zeus claim large
> sales, but I cannot find any user experiences etc. There was a user
> installation guide published in LRO in 1999 I understand. Anyone really
> using them? Is there any improvement in economy? Are they noisy? Given
> that belts need replacement at 60,000k (40,000 miles) how well do they
> last?
>
> Michael T
>


Well after finding out how much it cost to buy it and (if I wanted them to
fit it) + VAT just over 1K, I thought the longevity of a belt and the
damage that is caused by a snapped belt, you could repair with new parts 4
times for 1K. The engines probably knackard by then, so I would rather
stick with what I have got and its alot quieter than poxy gears!

Alistair


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Old 09-08-2005, 02:01   #5 (permalink)
SteveG
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Re: Zeus timing gear conversions?

MichaelT wrote:
> Developed to overcome the Tdi belt problems in the 1990s, Zeus claim large
> sales, but I cannot find any user experiences etc. There was a user
> installation guide published in LRO in 1999 I understand. Anyone really
> using them? Is there any improvement in economy? Are they noisy? Given that
> belts need replacement at 60,000k (40,000 miles) how well do they last?
>
> Michael T
>
>


I have no personal experience of the Zeus timing gear conversion but a
good friend of mine had it done on his 300Tdi Discovery and doesn't have
a bad word to say about it ... or the company. He took the vehicle to
Exeter to have the conversion done by Zeus (who provided his with a loan
car for the day). When he went back to collect the car the work had been
completed and the vehicle valeted. They pointed out a couple of things
they had noticed whilst doing the job that would need attention in the
future - hoses starting to crack, etc.

My mate called me on his mobile on the way back home and was very
enthusiastic. According to his initial assessment the Discovery was much
livelier, especially in the mid-range, and not noticeably noisier. Lets
face it a 300Tdi ain't the quietest engine ever made :-)

It's been about 18 months since he had the conversion done and the Disco
has covered loads of miles (to and from Germany every week) and he still
enthuses about it. I've stood with the bonnet up and listening hard
could hear the gears whirring away .. but it's hardly "noisy". He hasn't
been able to tell if the gear modification improved fuel consumption
because just a week later he had an Allard inter-cooler fitted.

HTH

--
Regards

Steve G
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Old 09-08-2005, 03:01   #6 (permalink)
Austin Shackles
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Posts: n/a
Re: Zeus timing gear conversions?

On or around Thu, 08 Sep 2005 05:59:24 GMT, "MichaelT"
<michaelt@thomzone.com> enlightened us thusly:

>Developed to overcome the Tdi belt problems in the 1990s, Zeus claim large
>sales, but I cannot find any user experiences etc. There was a user
>installation guide published in LRO in 1999 I understand. Anyone really
>using them? Is there any improvement in economy? Are they noisy? Given that
>belts need replacement at 60,000k (40,000 miles) how well do they last?


They're reputed to be noisier than a belt.
--
Austin Shackles. www.ddol-las.net my opinions are just that
"For millions of years, mankind lived just like the animals. Then
something happened which unleashed the power of our imagination -
we learned to talk." Pink Floyd (1994)
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Old 09-08-2005, 04:01   #7 (permalink)
Phillip Simpson
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Re: Zeus timing gear conversions?

Hi Michael,
I'm the bloke in Australia who "went to bat" for the Zeus
gears when they were attacked on the forum.

I know well the site that Pantellis refers to,and all I can say is
that all is not what it appears. I've defended the gears in the forums
and also in the legal system and in both cases am happy with the
results.

My own Disco had gears fitted at 103000km and they're going fine at
216,000 km. If you visit our website

www.yican.com.au

you will see that dyno data on the improvement in performance (about
27%, and fuel improvement is around 12%).

In real terms all this means I get about 120 kms extra per tank, and
can use my engine from 1100rpm upwards. On the timing belt you need to
wait for the turbo which comes in at 1850 rpm.

About 3 yrs ago I worked out that within 75000 kms a person with gears
saves money compared to someone on timing belt when its changed every
50000kms. Given the recent 35 % increase in diesel prices the period
is shorter.

I have both a disco and defender with the gears fitted, and wouldn't
want to even think of driving a 300 with the rubber timing belt.

Yes there is a bit more noise at idle, but this is from the injector
pump lifters. Yes there is an improvement in economy and better
performance as the engine can now be used from 1100 rpm, which makes
towing, around town driving in traffic , off road driving all much
better.
If you have an automatic then the improvement is very noticeable on
cold mornings when the engine is cold.

As I have stated frequently in the public domain, I'm a real user and
believer in the Zeus timing gears. I've thoroughly researched all the
"stories" and "expert opinions" and nothing has caused me to change my
opinion on the gears, nor seen any reason to stop selling them or
remove them from my own vehicles or those of many of my friends.

I would suggest you ring Graham at Zeus and speak to him directly
about the gears. Ask him the longest mileage on a set of gears that he
has seen ( about 250,000 miles).

Cheers

Phillip Simpson



On Thu, 08 Sep 2005 05:59:24 GMT, "MichaelT" <michaelt@thomzone.com>
wrote:

>Developed to overcome the Tdi belt problems in the 1990s, Zeus claim large
>sales, but I cannot find any user experiences etc. There was a user
>installation guide published in LRO in 1999 I understand. Anyone really
>using them? Is there any improvement in economy? Are they noisy? Given that
>belts need replacement at 60,000k (40,000 miles) how well do they last?
>
>Michael T
>


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Old 09-08-2005, 05:01   #8 (permalink)
Pantelis Giamarellos
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Re: Zeus timing gear conversions?

Phillip Hi,

I would be extremely interested to get more recent news on the development
of the dispute with the person who had this negative experience with the
Zeus timing kit(s).

There are a so many apparent advantages on this timing gear setup that it is
a pity for such a case to be creating problems to it for what appears to be
an unfortunate but extremely rare case.

Your valued input is expected with interest and anticipation.

Take care
Pantelis

"Phillip Simpson" <psimpson@yican.com.au> wrote in message
news:7u10i1t86343f27j9mud6qjnksftl0diun@4ax.com...
> Hi Michael,
> I'm the bloke in Australia who "went to bat" for the Zeus
> gears when they were attacked on the forum.
>
> I know well the site that Pantellis refers to,and all I can say is
> that all is not what it appears. I've defended the gears in the forums
> and also in the legal system and in both cases am happy with the
> results.
>
> My own Disco had gears fitted at 103000km and they're going fine at
> 216,000 km. If you visit our website
>
> www.yican.com.au
>
> you will see that dyno data on the improvement in performance (about
> 27%, and fuel improvement is around 12%).
>
> In real terms all this means I get about 120 kms extra per tank, and
> can use my engine from 1100rpm upwards. On the timing belt you need to
> wait for the turbo which comes in at 1850 rpm.
>
> About 3 yrs ago I worked out that within 75000 kms a person with gears
> saves money compared to someone on timing belt when its changed every
> 50000kms. Given the recent 35 % increase in diesel prices the period
> is shorter.
>
> I have both a disco and defender with the gears fitted, and wouldn't
> want to even think of driving a 300 with the rubber timing belt.
>
> Yes there is a bit more noise at idle, but this is from the injector
> pump lifters. Yes there is an improvement in economy and better
> performance as the engine can now be used from 1100 rpm, which makes
> towing, around town driving in traffic , off road driving all much
> better.
> If you have an automatic then the improvement is very noticeable on
> cold mornings when the engine is cold.
>
> As I have stated frequently in the public domain, I'm a real user and
> believer in the Zeus timing gears. I've thoroughly researched all the
> "stories" and "expert opinions" and nothing has caused me to change my
> opinion on the gears, nor seen any reason to stop selling them or
> remove them from my own vehicles or those of many of my friends.
>
> I would suggest you ring Graham at Zeus and speak to him directly
> about the gears. Ask him the longest mileage on a set of gears that he
> has seen ( about 250,000 miles).
>
> Cheers
>
> Phillip Simpson
>
>
>
> On Thu, 08 Sep 2005 05:59:24 GMT, "MichaelT" <michaelt@thomzone.com>
> wrote:
>
> >Developed to overcome the Tdi belt problems in the 1990s, Zeus claim

large
> >sales, but I cannot find any user experiences etc. There was a user
> >installation guide published in LRO in 1999 I understand. Anyone really
> >using them? Is there any improvement in economy? Are they noisy? Given

that
> >belts need replacement at 60,000k (40,000 miles) how well do they last?
> >
> >Michael T
> >

>



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Old 09-08-2005, 10:03   #9 (permalink)
Alex
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Re: Re: Zeus timing gear conversions?

On Thu, 8 Sep 2005 14:33:49 +0300, "Pantelis Giamarellos"
<pantg@otenet.gr> wrote:

>Phillip Hi,
>
>
>There are a so many apparent advantages on this timing gear setup that it is
>a pity for such a case to be creating problems to it for what appears to be
>an unfortunate but extremely rare case.
>


Beats me what the hell was wrong with Landrover that they couldn't
stick to a timing chain in the first place.

Alex


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Old 09-08-2005, 13:01   #10 (permalink)
Richard Brookman
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Posts: n/a
Re: Zeus timing gear conversions?

so Phillip Simpson was, like...
> Hi Michael,
> I'm the bloke in Australia who "went to bat" for the Zeus
> gears when they were attacked on the forum.


<snip>

> you will see that dyno data on the improvement in performance (about
> 27%, and fuel improvement is around 12%).


Phillip - I read all your comments on this a while back (hope I wasn't too
rude when I summarised it in an earlier post). What puzzles me is why a
vehicle with timing gears is said to perform so much better - in performance
and economy. There is a certain relationship between cam, crank and
injector pump which a newly-fitted belt will maintain, and presumably the
gearset will keep this relationship. How can a gearset improve on a new
belt? I can see a gearset maintaining the settings better than a belt over
time as the belt will wear and stretch (although when I took the old cambelt
off my 300Tdi it was a bit of a wrestling match, so it can't have stretched
much!) - but not by 27%. What do the gears do that a belt can't?

--
Rich
==============================
Disco 300 Tdi auto
S2a 88" SW
Tiggrr (V8 trialler)


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