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Casper said:
I hate to bust your bubble but you dont have 180rwkw with that sort of time. I agree, the BA is a heavy car however it is not considerably more heavy than my VCT. I have around 140-144rwkw and have run a [email protected] and feel the car is good for some sort of 14.9x run...and its an auto as well so no "manual" bonus points. I also so not have a chip in it. I would place a guess that you are running closer to 160rwkw with that time.
Just a matter of interest, what does your car with you in it weigh??? Are you running stock diff ratio in your VCT??

Cheers
 

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Casper said:
I hate to bust your bubble but you dont have 180rwkw with that sort of time. I agree, the BA is a heavy car however it is not considerably more heavy than my VCT. I have around 140-144rwkw and have run a [email protected] and feel the car is good for some sort of 14.9x run...and its an auto as well so no "manual" bonus points. I also so not have a chip in it. I would place a guess that you are running closer to 160rwkw with that time.
Whats not to say that he hasn't got 180rwkw, who said he can drive. No bagging the owner but maybe it wasnt the best the car can do.
 

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BOFH
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XRQTOR said:
Whats not to say that he hasn't got 180rwkw, who said he can drive. No bagging the owner but maybe it wasnt the best the car can do.
Correct however I would have to say unlikely. I would say that it would be a good "estimate" of the cars ability. Another 20odd rwkw and you couldnt help but go a fair bit quicker. Unless the gear change or launch is muffed every time that is and I would doubt that. I'm betting he knows how to drive his own car and probably did a good job of it. Fact is that getting it into the 14's is no easy feat, its an impressive time for any NA I6.


XR6 N/A Modded said:
Just a matter of interest, what does your car with you in it weigh??? Are you running stock diff ratio in your VCT??
Cheers
The car is basically stock except for exhaust and intake. All the running gear from the head to the tail is 100% factory.
The weight of the car is a bit harder to guess however, based on known weights for the AU, my own weight and an estimation of the fuel/coolant etc it should be around the 1700kg mark give or take. At a guess I'd say that is around 100kg lighter than yours. Thats why I figured you had closer to 160rwkw cause it would certainly take that much to get it into the 14's.

I'm not trying to put you down, I'm actually very impress at your time. I just dont think it would be 180rwkw.
 

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If i ever get my new car ill be taking it to the creek and i wont be at all dissapointed if i run 14.5 or higher but after quite a few passes and plenty of practice ill have the shits if i cant hit high 13's stock, i found that there not the easyest cars to get off the line in a hurry. HOw long has he had the car and how many times has he raced it they all play a majour part. Mate of mine owns a 10 sec VN ss but his best time is only a high 12.
 

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BOFH
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XRQTOR said:
If i ever get my new car ill be taking it to the creek and i wont be at all dissapointed if i run 14.5 or higher but after quite a few passes and plenty of practice ill have the shits if i cant hit high 13's stock, i found that there not the easyest cars to get off the line in a hurry. HOw long has he had the car and how many times has he raced it they all play a majour part. Mate of mine owns a 10 sec VN ss but his best time is only a high 12.
Considering that mine is not so easy to launch and I've only had about 7 or 8 runs in it since I had the mods done I could also use the same argument that I could get quite a bit better. Maybe even get into the 14.8's as my first 60' is very slow, only 2.3's. So if thats the case, and I know I have around 140rwkw, that actually just reinforces my point more.
There is no way he is a second, or probably even .5 of a second off the cars potential. They are not that hard to drive. The tale is really in the 60 foot time. If he can remember it than that will really help detemine if its off the pace. If its a 2.6 or so then yes, the car has heaps more potential. If its a 2.3 or a 2.2 then the car is probably running what it should.
In the end its impossible to say. We dont really know the car and the conditions. All we can do is make subjective comparisons based on known std's. I am not putting him down at all. I think the time is excellent however I just cant see a 180rwkw BA doing 14.8'[email protected] It doesnt add up.
 

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BLUEPRINT
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Discussion Starter #26
Casper said:
Considering that mine is not so easy to launch and I've only had about 7 or 8 runs in it since I had the mods done I could also use the same argument that I could get quite a bit better. Maybe even get into the 14.8's as my first 60' is very slow, only 2.3's. So if thats the case, and I know I have around 140rwkw, that actually just reinforces my point more.
There is no way he is a second, or probably even .5 of a second off the cars potential. They are not that hard to drive. The tale is really in the 60 foot time. If he can remember it than that will really help detemine if its off the pace. If its a 2.6 or so then yes, the car has heaps more potential. If its a 2.3 or a 2.2 then the car is probably running what it should.
In the end its impossible to say. We dont really know the car and the conditions. All we can do is make subjective comparisons based on known std's. I am not putting him down at all. I think the time is excellent however I just cant see a 180rwkw BA doing 14.8'[email protected] It doesnt add up.
half a second is bugger all. You could loose that time easily. It could have been a hot day, high or low humidity, wheel spin, shit tyres, bad fuel, gearbox slip(manual or auto), shit driver with bad reaction time, water or oil on track, etc etc. Rwkw's is not directly preportional to quarter mile times.
 

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BOFH
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xr6 ute said:
half a second is bugger all. You could loose that time easily. It could have been a hot day, high or low humidity, wheel spin, shit tyres, bad fuel, gearbox slip(manual or auto), shit driver with bad reaction time, water or oil on track, etc etc. Rwkw's is not directly preportional to quarter mile times.
No, rwkw is not directly related to the time but it is related VERY closely to thr MPH. As I said, unless every single pass was muffed it doesnt add up. 92mph is not 180rwkw.
Oh, and reaction time is not counted in the ET. My reaction time on my pass was over 3 seconds.
 

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Unless he post some more info we can only guess he either doenst have 180rwkw or he cant drive or another issue.
 

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Here is a link to my thread which has more details about the mods I had done, and also a couple of pics I took this morning, just FYI.

http://www.fordforums.com/showthread.php?t=88347

To answer the question re fuel consumption: the harder you drive it, the more you use. Simple. And with new mods, its hard not to drive it harder, around town and therefore use more fuel. Especially when the harder you push it, the nicer it sounds...

However, ALL THINGS BEING EQUAL, the fuel economy is rather improved from what I can tell so far. On the way over to Melbourne from Adelaide I avereaged around 12.1 L per 100km. On the way back I got 9.8. Now obviously there may have been differences in my driving on both trips so its not identical. But it was not substantially different either way. I stopped once, in Horsham, both ways. I sat on between 100 and 130kmh the entire way except for towns. Traffic was similar both ways. So thats the info on fuel economy I have so far. Have not taken much notice around town yet, I'll wait for the next tank.

Re the rwkw, I find it very difficult to believe that with just exhaust mods and a chip on a BA 6 you could get it to 180rwkw, which is similar to XR6T rw power. Without doing cams and other stuff, I just cannot see it. And at the end of the day, you would feel it if it was. I have driven enough XR6Ts (manual and auto) enough to know what that kind of power feels like.

And the Nm issue is not that clear cut either. Before my exhaust mods, the dyno gave an ESTIMATE of a tiny bit under 400Nm. Now with the exhaust mods, I am not sure since I have not had the Nm measured, and on a dyno it is only an estimate anyway. However, if the dyno was correct with 180rwkw, I am wondering what it would show re Nm, if it is measured... would it show THAT far off 450Nm of an XR6T?

In any case, despite mine showing as 182rwkw on one dyno, and despite the fact it does feel and sound much better, it does not feel anything like a stock XR6T and that is a fact. I know the difference well and no one can convince me that its what it feels like, even Nm aside. What it does have is a much better pull in higher revs than before, more power across the board and a really nice sound to it. Not too loud, does not drone inside and it doesnt sound cheap and tacky.

My opinion re the rwkw/dyno issue is pretty much what Casper and others have said. The only issue I have with it is as CSV said in that it could very well be false and misleading conduct in the course of carrying on trade or commerce under the Trade Practices legislation, but since they never claim the figure is NOT from their dyno, it is probably difficult to argue that, technically. I do think it is misleading however, as in a practical situation, people would expect that figure on all dynos, and therefore expect relative performance on a track....

Aside from that, if you want such mods done, go into it with your eyes open, with realistic expectations of the results you will get, with some research under your belt and with an attitude that is less focussed on the rwkw/dyno figure than the actual performance and feel of the mods themselves.

Any dyno can be set to tell you your Focus has 200rwkw, if the users so choose to. But that doesnt count. If it does not go relatively that fast on a track, then the figures are pointless. The dyno means nothing when it comes to how it feels and the fun you can have with it.

Just be realistic and enjoy what you have.... as long as it beats Commies, and you get a decent track time (which any 14.xx in a NA BA 6 is IMO - I would be happy to get that time two weeks from now) then its all good, right?
 

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In a blue Galaxy
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I have 152rwkw with a 95mph and 14.6 1.4 mile. Theres no way a 180rwkw XR6 would do a 14.9 1/4 with only a 92mph. Not a chance!
 

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BLUEPRINT
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Discussion Starter #35
Why is it, that people cant believe that with a few changes, the BA 6cylinder cant possibly come from 140rwkw(standard) to 180rwkws? The cold air on standard cars is small and restrictive, the air filters are thick cardboard crap which are impossible to get free flowing air through, the zorst are small and have 20 muflers, resonators catylitic converters(only designed for zero emissions), and a computer that detunes the engine for maximum life spand and best fuel economy. It's only a 40kw increase!?! how do you think that FPV makes a boss 260 into a boss 290? a turbo? a supercharger? or extreme internal work? No, a zorst, a filter, a more radical fuel gusling chip for the computer. Same with HSV, what makes a VX SS 235kw different to a VX GTS 300kw? thats 65kw increase with similar mods.
And i'm sure in time, we will all see chip, cam, and exhaust packages for all the ford motors which will considerable increase the power.
Oh yeah XRchic, do you really believe that with all the mods you've done to your car, and all the money you've spent it, it has on increased the engines power by 20 piss weak kilowatts? if it has girl take the shit back!
 

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xr6 ute said:
Why is it, that people cant believe that with a few changes, the BA 6cylinder cant possibly come from 140rwkw(standard) to 180rwkws? The cold air on standard cars is small and restrictive, the air filters are thick cardboard crap which are impossible to get free flowing air through, the zorst are small and have 20 muflers, resonators catylitic converters(only designed for zero emissions), and a computer that detunes the engine for maximum life spand and best fuel economy. It's only a 40kw increase!?! how do you think that FPV makes a boss 260 into a boss 290? a turbo? a supercharger? or extreme internal work? No, a zorst, a filter, a more radical fuel gusling chip for the computer. Same with HSV, what makes a VX SS 235kw different to a VX GTS 300kw? thats 65kw increase with similar mods.
And i'm sure in time, we will all see chip, cam, and exhaust packages for all the ford motors which will considerable increase the power.
Oh yeah XRchic, do you really believe that with all the mods you've done to your car, and all the money you've spent it, it has on increased the engines power by 20 piss weak kilowatts? if it has girl take the shit back!
Sorry to be a smart ass but FPV make the Boss 260 a Boss 290 by upping the c/p ratio, bigger cams, different valvetrain and i think filter and zorst like you said.
 

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BSR Twin System (tm)
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xr6 ute said:
how do you think that FPV makes a boss 260 into a boss 290? a turbo? a supercharger? or extreme internal work? No, a zorst, a filter, a more radical fuel gusling chip for the computer.
You forgot to add different Camshafts and higher compression Pistons. You might want to think before you speak.
 

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xr6 ute said:
Why is it, that people cant believe that with a few changes, the BA 6cylinder cant possibly come from 140rwkw(standard) to 180rwkws? The cold air on standard cars is small and restrictive, the air filters are thick cardboard crap which are impossible to get free flowing air through, the zorst are small and have 20 muflers, resonators catylitic converters(only designed for zero emissions), and a computer that detunes the engine for maximum life spand and best fuel economy. It's only a 40kw increase!?! how do you think that FPV makes a boss 260 into a boss 290? a turbo? a supercharger? or extreme internal work? No, a zorst, a filter, a more radical fuel gusling chip for the computer. Same with HSV, what makes a VX SS 235kw different to a VX GTS 300kw? thats 65kw increase with similar mods.
And i'm sure in time, we will all see chip, cam, and exhaust packages for all the ford motors which will considerable increase the power.
Oh yeah XRchic, do you really believe that with all the mods you've done to your car, and all the money you've spent it, it has on increased the engines power by 20 piss weak kilowatts? if it has girl take the shit back!
Oh dear..... :rofl:

Gee, no, I spent ALL that massive amount of money and I expected to get the same rwkw as an XR6T - yes of course. How stupid am I? I have no idea how Ive wasted my money. And having said above that I have driven many XR6Ts, both manual and auto, you think for one second I wouldnt be able to tell the difference between 180rwkw and 158rwkw? ROFL Why, do you think, did I take it back to get dynod the day after it was done? Geesh.

If you think you can get 180rwkw out of THOSE mods, then youre dreamin buddy. Id like to see you find someone who can get that rw power out of any BA NA 6 with those mods... coz Ill be there.

And who told you a BA exhaust is particularly restrictive? Have you seen a stock one? Bwahahahahahahahaha
 

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xr6 ute said:
Same with HSV, what makes a VX SS 235kw different to a VX GTS 300kw? thats 65kw increase with similar mods.

XRQTOR said:
Sorry to be a smart ass but FPV make the Boss 260 a Boss 290 by upping the c/p ratio, bigger cams, different valvetrain and i think filter and zorst like you said.
Likewise the VX GTS over the VX SS........GTS has a different Cam and different Heads.

What does a stock BA XR6 do the quarter in? taking into account...their weight?
 

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xr6 ute said:
the zorst are small and have 20 muflers, resonators catylitic converters(only designed for zero emissions)
The standard exhaust is actually quite well flowing nothing much wrong with it at all just a bit quiet IMO :p

xr6 ute said:
and a computer that detunes the engine for maximum life spand and best fuel economy.
Best fuel economy when running an AFR at arount 10-11 bwahahaha seeing stoitchemetric balance is at 14.7

xr6 ute said:
It's only a 40kw increase!?! how do you think that FPV makes a boss 260 into a boss 290? a turbo? a supercharger? or extreme internal work? No, a zorst, a filter, a more radical fuel gusling chip for the computer.
As others have said different valvetrain, cams, C/R and XR8's and GT's actually run the same Intake and Exhaust systems...

xr6 ute said:
Same with HSV, what makes a VX SS 235kw different to a VX GTS 300kw? thats 65kw increase with similar mods.
The 300kW motor is modified extensively internally by callaway in the US and then shipped to HSV
 
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