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351C stroked to 400 cubes vs 400M

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Is it worth doing a 351C stroking it to 400 cubes or use a 400M instead. Anyone done the math ???
 

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Boost Is for Pussies
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Basically, 400m is a bigger heavier block, with bigger main bearings. The 351C based stroker will have a less optimal stroke to rod length ratio, but the advantages are lighter (shorter deck height), easier to find with a small block bellhousing bolt pattern, lighter crank (smaller main bearings, smaller rod bearings on a stroker).
Hmmm. what else.
Shorter deck height makes fitment into tight engine bays easier, easier as far as headers aswell. and no messing with manifold spacers and associated vacuum leaks.
Now, a 400 based stroker..... how far can they be taken? bueller? bueller?

Ben
 

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A 400 can be cheaper to build than stroking a 351C, only thing is you need a C6 and I think you got to shorten the tailshaft and need a custom made trans mount.
Engine mounts are different to the 351C and the headers you would need to have custom made and would probably cost around $500 more than the 351C headers.

The 400 weight is not a big deal (unless your're a serious drag racer) it's around 11kg heavier.
 

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Plus the weight of the C6...... C4 is a bunch lighter I belive?
 

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JG33 said:
A 400 can be cheaper to build than stroking a 351C, only thing is you need a C6 and I think you got to shorten the tailshaft and need a custom made trans mount.
Engine mounts are different to the 351C and the headers you would need to have custom made and would probably cost around $500 more than the 351C headers.


The 400 weight is not a big deal (unless your're a serious drag racer) it's around 11kg heavier.
on most fords there is 3 settings on the rear crossmember. the standard x member bolts up to the rear set. headers are the same, just get a set that are the tallest, not the shortest, as the can get too close to the floor.

BTW, i have a c6, tailshaft and set of mounts in the for sale section;)

the mounts i have, place the engine slightly lower, and slightly back a bit, for better weight balance and transfer.
 

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I perfer going the small block option. A non-standard engines a lot of hassle. Remember you have to run spacers between the manifold to get an aftermarket manifold to fit. If you going to do it legally (engineers etc)? It'll be more benificial to go the 400M or a 460. If you don't want to spend $ on engineers etc 351C the go.

Brenden
 

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brenx said:
I perfer going the small block option. A non-standard engines a lot of hassle. Remember you have to run spacers between the manifold to get an aftermarket manifold to fit. If you going to do it legally (engineers etc)? It'll be more benificial to go the 400M or a 460. If you don't want to spend $ on engineers etc 351C the go.

Brenden
why spacers?? edelbrock do a single and a dual plane, and holley do a street dominator single plain. if you want more, then get the spacers. i think weiand made the spacers i use for my blower manifold. they fitted up ok, with a little port matching to suit. the engineers should be quite easy, as standard mounting positions are used all round. as long as the extractors clear the floor, you're laughing. especially in nsw, where the rules are pretty lax.
 

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The 400m has a different deck height to a 351C from memory. I've been told the 400M needs spacers under the intake manifold to get a 351C manifold to fit.

Brenden
 
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i also have a dual plane 4 barrel edlebrock performer manifold for a 400, (and the rest of the engine) also have a set of mounts. and extractors, that were all in a guys XD at one stage.... and i have big block FMX bellhousing on the way from the US...

Brenx, crushu f150 already just mentioned that you can use normal Clevo intakes with the Weiand spacers....
 

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HOWEVER - Weiand no longer makes the spacers. They are still on the Holley site, but they are discontinued. The only intake made for the 400 is the dual from Edelbrock. They do not sell a single plane for the 400. Holley does not make intakes for the 400. The may be an old SP2P out there, but those all sucked rocks anyway. See pricemotorsports.com for other spacers. Warning - not cheap.

The big problem with the 400 (and it's a 400, not a 400M) is the deck clearance and the lack of pistons. You can bush the rods and run a 351C piston, but you'll ahve to work at it to get the pistons up close to the deck. And any US 2V heads built after 1975 suck badly in the exhaust ports.
 

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Hello Falcon67.
Tim Meyer in Minnesota sells a custom Hyper piston for the 400. They are the Badger brand. Currently there are two types of piston for the 400 offered by Tim. Check his web site:
http://www.tmeyerinc.com

I bought a set of pistons that have 'zero deck clearance' for my 400 rebuild. Should give 10.5:1 CR with 2V open chamber Cleveland heads. Running on lpg.
Cheers
Craig
 

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I wonder what kind of a compression ratio standard pistons would give with a set of CC 302 heads on top? Would have to be close to 10:1.
 

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Hello Rhett.
You will certainly improve the standard CR (8.0:1) by using 302 closed chamber heads. That is what is happening in the US, although they are using flat top pistons and machining a dish of specified depth to achieve the desired CR.
Look up Tim Meyer's web site. It will give you an idea of what is being done with the 400. Stroker kits giving 434 cu i, and talk of designing cranks to achieve 459 cu i!
I have a single plane Holley Street Dominator for the 400 on my XD. The spacers were way out of alignment with both the heads and the Weiand X-celerator manifold.
I got a set of headers (Lukey tri-y's for the 351C) to fit into an XD with a bit of modification.
You can view my build on the following site:
http://homepage.mac.com/kionga/PhotoAlbum6.html
Craig
 

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I am using the weiand spacers under a Newby Blower manifold. Neither items are built very well, so a bit of port matching is required. pretty easy with a die grinder.
Clevo extractors normally fit OK, some brands may need to be lengthened to clear the floor.
 

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Edelbrock do a single and a dual plane 400m manifold
Holley used to do a Street Dominator 400m manifold
Weiand do a Xcellerator 400m manifold.
That should cover most peoples needs anyway, without having to get spacers etc.

BTW, you can get a nodular crank, steel h beam rods and forged pistons, that will make 434ci in a 400m block :)
 

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kionga said:
Hello Rhett. You will certainly improve the standard CR (8.0:1) by using 302 closed chamber heads. That is what is happening in the US, although they are using flat top pistons and machining a dish of specified depth to achieve the desired CR. Look up Tim Meyer's web site. It will give you an idea of what is being done with the 400. Stroker kits giving 434 cu i, and talk of designing cranks to achieve 459 cu i! I have a single plane Holley Street Dominator for the 400 on my XD. The spacers were way out of alignment with both the heads and the Weiand X-celerator manifold. I got a set of headers (Lukey tri-y's for the 351C) to fit into an XD with a bit of modification. You can view my build on the following site:
http://homepage.mac.com/kionga/PhotoAlbum6.html
Craig
Thanks Craig. Great pics.
Any text or comments to suppliment them?
 

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CRUSHU F150 said:
Edelbrock do a single and a dual plane 400m manifold
Holley used to do a Street Dominator 400m manifold. Weiand do a Xcellerator 400m manifold. That should cover most peoples needs anyway, without having to get spacers etc. BTW, you can get a nodular crank, steel h beam rods and forged pistons, that will make 434ci in a 400m block :)
I've only seen the Performer for the 400.

I'm really interested in the 400 'cos I'm looking for heaps of low rev torque for the street, without having to build a motor to survive 8000 RPM.
 

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Rhett said:
I've only seen the Performer for the 400.

I'm really interested in the 400 'cos I'm looking for heaps of low rev torque for the street, without having to build a motor to survive 8000 RPM.
I have 2 different 400m Edelbrock manifolds. 1 is a single plane, the other dual plane.

i have also seen a street dominator (Holley), but didn't buy it, and have heard od a Weiand Xcellerator.
 
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