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Australian XR8 Member
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Discussion Starter #1
Does anyone have any figures for difference in power/drive nature swapping original (cobra?) manifold to the tubular GT40 upper? Is it worth the money? Any power gain figures? Engine would be 220kw - standard 70mm TB, headwork etc.
 

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CEO - The BSR Group
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4,400 Posts
AUII XR8 said:
Does anyone have any figures for difference in power/drive nature swapping original (cobra?) manifold to the tubular GT40 upper? Is it worth the money? Any power gain figures? Engine would be 220kw - standard 70mm TB, headwork etc.
Standard upper intake manifold on all Windsors since and including the EL2XR8 has been the "Explorer" type manifold. The ELGT is the only exception, as it received the GT40.

Check http://www.nswxrclub.org.au/techlibrary/intakemanifold/intake.htm on our club site for a great writeup on Windsor manifolds.

Ford quote the Explorer manifold as being good for up to 400hp, and the GT40 for about 450hp. Bottom line - they are very pricey, you need a GT40 lower as well, and you are unlikely to find vastly improved gains. I'd be putting the money into something more "meat and potato" like cam change or head work.

:thup: :s6:
 

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Two SC 61's = trouble
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The Cobra lower and the Gt40 lower is the same part #
There are heaps of after market inlets available now at
quite an amount cheaper.. Complete and cheaper than gt 40 top. Depends if you want to keep original. About 230 kw max unless Cobra/ gt40 lower is ported. Or blown etc..
 

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Ford Member
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292 Posts
I had much the same enquiry - I have the 200kw engine and was talking to crow cams about fitting a cam. His advice was to not worry about it and go the gt40p heads from yella terra instead as this is supposedly the only difference between my engine and the T-series vehicles (not T3).

Sound like Bollocks or a fair thing - and extra 20Kw by fitting thise heads? Its only $600 exchange so that's not too bad I thought.
 

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Pursuit Reincarnation Dog
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Upper intake manifolds are not the main area for improvement. It is the lower that makes significant difference, especially the front two cylinders. In my extensive research (there is a previous thread in here somewhere on intakes) the Edelbrock was extremely good, however I ended up going for the TrickFlow Track Heat setup www.trickflow.com which gives very good flow figures and even numbers between the different cylinders.

To see these intakes, look for a thread 'Santa Brings Presents for Aussie Pete's Car' or something like that in the Pub.

As for the differences between the 200 and 220 engines, there is more to it. Of ourse there's the heads with porting and bigger valves plus decking to increase compression, camshaft, throttle body, match porting the lower intake, bigger cats, and of course EEC5 calibration.
 
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Actually guys the best all round intake(in conventional 5.0 style) is the Holley. It consistently out does all the others in mid range torque and upper rpm hp.
Trouble is it only faces the drivers side so it's not as simple as bolting on one of the others. But you know some things are worth moving the airbox for and the boot is a good place for the battery anyway.

Pete.
 

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Ford Member
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Aussie Pete said:
Upper intake manifolds are not the main area for improvement. It is the lower that makes significant difference, especially the front two cylinders. In my extensive research (there is a previous thread in here somewhere on intakes) the Edelbrock was extremely good, however I ended up going for the TrickFlow Track Heat setup www.trickflow.com which gives very good flow figures and even numbers between the different cylinders.

To see these intakes, look for a thread 'Santa Brings Presents for Aussie Pete's Car' or something like that in the Pub.

As for the differences between the 200 and 220 engines, there is more to it. Of ourse there's the heads with porting and bigger valves plus decking to increase compression, camshaft, throttle body, match porting the lower intake, bigger cats, and of course EEC5 calibration.
Wow, that is a whole lot of stuff for a measly 20kw gain. So basically you would be looking at about $5000 for a 10% gain.

Dare I say it but maybe I should have ut the extra 3K down up front and bought the SS ute instead.

How much would it actually cost to take a 5.0 ford V8 to 250kw and beyond? I'd really like to hit that figure but it seems that supercharging appears to the most cost effective option or something weird like a 351 efi swapout.

Now I say this while having no idea about the finer points of engine mods etc.
 

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Pursuit Reincarnation Dog
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TheBow said:
Wow, that is a whole lot of stuff for a measly 20kw gain. So basically you would be looking at about $5000 for a 10% gain.
Dare I say it but maybe I should have ut the extra 3K down up front and bought the SS ute instead.
How much would it actually cost to take a 5.0 ford V8 to 250kw and beyond? I'd really like to hit that figure but it seems that supercharging appears to the most cost effective option or something weird like a 351 efi swapout.
Now I say this while having no idea about the finer points of engine mods etc.
There's plusses and minuses to both. XR8 gets tray liner, separate tray, space in the cab, six stack CD, better trim and finish overall amongs other things.

To get 250kW I think Herrod charge in the region of 7k. For that, I would go for the stroker any day of the week at around 7k with girdle, however I think it is realistically only around 240kW. However, the torque is where the stroker is at!
 

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Ford Member
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Aussie Pete said:

There's plusses and minuses to both. XR8 gets tray liner, separate tray, space in the cab, six stack CD, better trim and finish overall amongs other things.

To get 250kW I think Herrod charge in the region of 7k. For that, I would go for the stroker any day of the week at around 7k with girdle, however I think it is realistically only around 240kW. However, the torque is where the stroker is at!
Fair enough..I remeber a MOTOR review of the Herrod XR8 vs the Maloo and it didn't come off too well.

I didn't check the amount of holden advertising though so its hard to judge if the reviewer was Holden bigot or not.

Strangely I haven't seen any reviews on drive etc since the XR8's started coming out in 220kw guise and matching the SS's power.

If I was buying on solely the engine then I would have bought the SS but value for money and avilabilty pushed my in favour of the XR8 - its a better ute. But it could really do with that extra 20-50kw :)
 

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Pursuit Reincarnation Dog
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TheBow said:
Fair enough..I remeber a MOTOR review of the Herrod XR8 vs the Maloo and it didn't come off too well.
The ute herrods had in this test had problems with the unichip as the rev limit was too low for the new cam. once fixed it apparently went way better.
 

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Ford Member
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Oh ok..fair enough then.

I can't remember if they mentioned it in the article, they really should drive the Herrod car agin then and report on that as a postscript.

I think the Herrod ute looked way better than the maloo but I am probably biased. The Maloo is too fussy with all the wings and stuff although I must admit the 250kW pursuit looks pretty horny.

Ok I am definately biased - The SS ute is my mortal enemy, pity I only have 200kw :-(
 

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T5 Expert Operator
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TheBow said:
Oh ok..fair enough then.

I can't remember if they mentioned it in the article, they really should drive the Herrod car agin then and report on that as a postscript.

I think the Herrod ute looked way better than the maloo but I am probably biased. The Maloo is too fussy with all the wings and stuff although I must admit the 250kW pursuit looks pretty horny.

Ok I am definately biased - The SS ute is my mortal enemy, pity I only have 200kw :-(
Time for a Herrod 250kw package mate.
 

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Pursuit Reincarnation Dog
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THE BOW:
Time for me to be honest now. That ute in Motor was specified as the 250kW engine. However, it had other work done such as blueprinting, internal painting and much other stuff to make it rev easier. Hence to say it was a direct measure of the 250kW package on offer for the 7k would be a lie. The engine in that car was more like 11k from memory.

Trust me, you have a 200kW and the best starting point is the stroker. You can do bolt-ons from there.
 

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T5 Expert Operator
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On the subject pf GT40 upper intkae manifolds, not talking about power or anything but i reckon they look awesome. If i get a windsor 302, i'll definitly get em fitted. I think it's like $800 for it.
 
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EF_Falcon_GuY said:
On the subject pf GT40 upper intkae manifolds, not talking about power or anything but i reckon they look awesome. If i get a windsor 302, i'll definitly get em fitted. I think it's like $800 for it.
While your at it get a 351w and stroke that. It's actually cheaper than stroking a 302.

I'm doing a 391w stroker in my XE ute. I'll be using the Edelbrock Victor 5.8 EFI intake.
Simulations suggest 480lb/ft @ 2000rpm,523lb/[email protected] and a lazy 423hp at 5000rpm!

Pete.
 

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Ford Member
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Sounds mad, I don't know what the conversion to Nm's is for the torque figures - I'm a metric child.

I'd be happy with a warm 351 anyway but I didn't think that it would fit.

I don';t think I could justify such a radical change on my almost brand new ute so I'll be eating SS dust for some time :-(. Stroking would be a different story but engine swap no way!

Now if I had a lazy 10K then it would be a different story.

Why oh why did Ford go the 5.0 ltr instead of the 5.8ltr??
 
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480lb/ft=650Nm,523lb/ft=709Nm
423hp=315Kw. I can get a lot more hp but I want to maintain the enormous low end torque and use tall diff gears(3.00 : 1).

A 351 will fit but it won't clear the bonnet(this is probably the main reason why Ford didn't use them).
It won't clear on my XE either. So I'm going to weld bosses to the upper and mount a shaker on it....that way Ive got no stick on plastic crap on the bonnet.

Just wack a Paxton NOVI 2000 on yours.

Pete.
 
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