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HSV eater
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207 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
IF FPV decide to bump power up ( no doubt it would be over 300kW this time) then HSV would be gone. Even if they upgraded again, they wouldnt be able to cannabalise the GTS. So not only will Ford have the chasis and quality advantage, but now we might finally start seeing some decent times. (no doubt weight will go down a bit). I guess in its defence, HSVs staple models are now AWD recreational vehicles but the sedans marketing would come undone.

This is a dead horse being flogged, but what would everyone like to see on the FPV IIs, as opinions may have changed since last discussed.
Personally, ID like to see
* More integrated and aggressive body kit
* Active braking diff and ESP( switchable)
* Mustangs six speed gearbox
* more power, easily acheived through non ribbed air intake, and better extractors, maybe VCT

Thanks for your time fellas
 

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gone
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10,402 Posts
Personally

I would like to see the a Nice 350kw FPV vehicle weighing in under 1800kg with a price tag of 80k on road, mass produced, no upgrades for 5 years, and a resale value that will match the market

I wouldnt like to see a 350kw FPV, at 2100kg, with a 95k price tag, with upgraded models every 2 years, and resale value dropping 20k in the 1st 12 months!
 

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goooone
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2,708 Posts
HSV could counter punch with over 300kw They have done it before remember a VT GTS had 220kw & a VT2 Executive V8 then had 220kw
 

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HSV eater
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207 Posts
Discussion Starter #4
yes but that was Holden and HSV, not HSV and also a different engine. HSV wouldnt cannabilise their own range i dont think. I wouldnt like the GT to rise in price, its a great bang for your bucks as is. Keep the GT cheap, with an upgrade package, and the GTP needs more differentation. Pursute could use Torsion bar IRS as a stop gap to replace live axle.
 

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CEO - The BSR Group
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4,400 Posts
HSV will have 6L (they were running 6.2L mules for a long time) and this had better be in the minds of FPV. The only thing that FPV needs to improve in their vehicles is straight line performance (and sorting out the Brembo issues). They also need to address some other non-production areas such as customer relations (communication), and resale value (in light of certain recent events).
 

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Registered
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203 Posts
with these low volume cars, HSV (and probably FPV) will be essentially selling everything they can make. i was surprised when the Y-Series equated to new sales records.. it just affirms there will always be demand at these numbers. It would take a near marketing catastrophe for HSV to be 'gone'.
 

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Patriotic Aussie car fan
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313 Posts
Well I can't wait til FPV bring out their 450kW 1100kg 2 door. There is no confirmed info on any of the future FPV plans. This thread is built on guesswork. I should have known when the title is 'half baked HSV's'.

Can't wait for that V10 GTHO hey.
 

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Ford Member
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1,054 Posts
Id like to see 80- 100kg weight loss over the whole range
6 speed auto and Manuals with improved gearing to suit
Slightly more agressive and integrated kit
GT get GTP's front seats and GTP get reverse sensing as std
A bit more power {320-330kw} to at the minimum compete with Gen 4 Clubsports but perhaps only claim 300kw. HSV started this kw measurement crap so we should respond by underclaiming.
XR8 already needs more straight line let alone Gen 4 SS coming
Then work FPV turbo in between.
 

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461 Posts
With the gen1V just around the corner, d.o.d and 350kw I doubt HSV or holden are overly concerned. Gen 1V hits the ground in 2005 according to all reports, and there's still plenty of life in the gen111 in the meantime....
So yeah, come on FPV hand over some more power...... HSV could use an excuse to go for more, although its starting to get ridiculous this claytons power war.......
 

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We Love Greb Murpy
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3,022 Posts
I say get the s/c out and show mister HSV where to go.
 

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328 Posts
Lot's of talk about less weight and more power......

But it costs a lot more to get weight out of a car as you have to engineer that for the entire product range. (e.g. M3 CSL is $220k versus a Std M3 at about $150k)

Power increases can be more cheaply obtained on a smaller scale.

And just take a look at what's out there as an example of what might be possible......

Mercedes E55
350kw (supercharged 5.4 V8...sound familiar)
700nm
1835kg (sound familiar)

Performance 0-100 in 4.7 seconds!!!

Just goes to show what can be achieved when a more powerful engine gets mated to a decent 6 speed transmission and some nice electronis to assist with traction.

Ford are already using the latest Bosch system in the Territory. A 6 speed auto is on the way (same one used by BMW / Audi / and co). Mate that to a supercharged 8, and unless Ford stuff up gearing etc, weight shouldn't be a problem getting this car to sub 5sec 0-100 times.

Will that kill HSV?? Not a chance, be it a year earlier or year later, they'll have something with performance so similar it won't matter.

Lot's to look forward to.....at least until the Killjoys legislate a halt to the latest cycle of power increases (Damb their oily hides!!!)
 

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328 Posts
Funkypig said:
Well I can't wait til FPV bring out their 450kW 1100kg 2 door. There is no confirmed info on any of the future FPV plans. This thread is built on guesswork. I should have known when the title is 'half baked HSV's'.

Can't wait for that V10 GTHO hey.
Ford have in their vehicle pricing plans an FPV vehicle with a price in excess of any existing FPV product. (This I know to be a fact, but won't post any details of how on a public forum)

Does this means that it forms part of their Business Plan?? No.
Does it mean that they have allocated the necessary engineering resources? No again.
Neither of these things could be confirmed by anyone other than a Ford employee

But it does indicate that the car is clearly on their radar. For all we know it could be done already. If you take the FPV turbo as an example, engine development etc is done and the vehicle signed off, sitting there waiting for the release of the new gearboxes next year.

This speculation business is fun!! Frustrating as all hell...but fun!!
 

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Interloper from LS1.com
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768 Posts
GTS Coupe and Sedan are already special order only - 285kw has got too close (or 292kw DIN if you want to do the mines bigger than yours with Ford).

Lots of rumours about 6 or 6.2 mules running around already, including a 6.2l US GTO that came off the line a few weeks ago according to sources.

Once thing you can be sure of is that HSV will not be backwards in coming forward - Remains to be seen what FPV will do. Once again, they aren't stupid either, but HSV have made a bucket of cash to spend on R&D over the last decade. Ford on the other hand haven't done as well and spend the research budget on the bread and butter cars, and the Territory. BA is selling well, hopefully making plenty of money, so hopefully that means a few more beer vouchers in the FPV "lets make a GTHO" fund.
 

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My nuts for an XR
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16 Posts
FalconIV said:
IF FPV decide to bump power up ( no doubt it would be over 300kW this time) then HSV would be gone. Even if they upgraded again, they wouldnt be able to cannabalise the GTS. So not only will Ford have the chasis and quality advantage, but now we might finally start seeing some decent times. (no doubt weight will go down a bit). I guess in its defence, HSVs staple models are now AWD recreational vehicles but the sedans marketing would come undone.
Personally I find the VY 'unpretty' at best and I fail to understand the buying public at all.

The performance numbers arent that different outside a chat at the local bar or the drag strip. Real world driving theres little in it, 90% of buyers dont give a stuff about .x of a 10th across the quarter. They're going to drive them and find them both bloody rapid. Your point above assumes HSV dont know what they're doing and FPV can cast them a fatal broadside, I think past experience shows HSV will land on their feet. Hopefully with FPV right along side them to the benefit of the buying public.
 

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Patriotic Aussie car fan
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313 Posts
There are three options here:
1- HSV have no future plans, and FPV have heaps of excitement on the way.
2- Same as option 1, only names reversed.
3- (realistic) Both HSV and FPV know that each other will be planning to go better in power (and everything else too), and they are each planning for this.

The fact that the 300kW HSV's are now special order confirms that their days are numbered. Which makes me think there is a new (faster) GTS on the way.

It's strange how people compare the almost dead CB4 300kW GTS with the "imaginary" 320kW FPV.
 

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Can Holden make the Gen III a 7.0L. CSV have a 330kw 5.7L V8 than a 380kw 6.5L V8. The stroke is almost the same as the Boss motors. I think it is 104.4 but the bore remains the same . So why dont Holden Increase the bore from 99 to 104. Ford can do the Same in the Boss motor . If they can increase the bore the might beable to make the Boss motor a 6.0L DOHC V8. might even rev hard too.
 

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1,500 Posts
I believe Ford will make around $210 million profit this year, so there is plenty of money there for future models and more money if the Territory does well. As for a substanstial upgrade for BA2 don't hold your breath because you will probably be dissapointed.
 

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BSR Driver #3 - Team ADD
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501 Posts
As long as someone makes a car i cannot break its diff clutch and gearbox and engine i will be happy who makes what.

Oh and with Victoria being the Revenue State no matter if you have 76kw or 500kw you cant spped anyway.

Simon
 

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1,500 Posts
Thats why old GT's were so good. Toploaders, C4/9/10's and nodular iron nine inchers with 31 spline axles could take a lot of abuse. And of course you can speed in Victoria if you want to, you just have to know where the speed cameras sit. In Geelong they always sit in the same old places.
 
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