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blue blooded ford fan
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190 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
well, after weighing up the pros and cons of building up a 250ci XFlow turbo, it seems that the cons (insurance/engineering) outway the pros. But i have always been sort of leaning towards building up a stinkin hot 351C soon, and it seems that it will be sooner than i thought :) only things i wanna know is what u guys that have done this before have been showen to be proven performers time after time, as in, what parts (brand names) have u guys used in your blocks. Also diff ratios, trannys and converters. It will be in an XE Fairmont Ghia still :) oh and also one of the most important things that i am after is an exhaust not to die for, ala GTHO :) any help appreciated guys, thanks in advance.
 

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xe 351
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67 Posts
are you building it yourself or getting it built? what state?


and did you get that w.d.f.doo pic from the newsgroup i posted it on?? pisser!



and how did my status become 'Australian XE Member'?
 

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blue blooded ford fan
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190 Posts
Discussion Starter #3
i am in victoria and i will have a bit of a hand in building it, but i will be having very good mates who have built many a 351 before doing it for me.
what newsgroup??
 

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Pursuit Reincarnation Dog
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7,777 Posts
The heads are a big thing. My Clevo went ballistic after doing the heads (mild porting, CC, valve seats etc), and a cam. Didn't touch the bottom end at all.
 

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blue blooded ford fan
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190 Posts
Discussion Starter #5
im willing to spend, at the moment, 5000 on the engine alone, and the guys will put it all together for sfa!
the main thing im interested in is the exhaust note. i will probably be runnin it on straight gas too, yes, i am a cheap ****, :p.
 

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What sort of heads are you going to run?? That meakes a huge difference.
I had an XB GT Sedan with 4v heads, torker, 750dp, crane F246, genie ET351 extractors... it flew.... the best I got was 13.7 with little tyres,a 3.0 diff and a misfire about 5500 ( power was 3800-7000).
You need a program like engine analyser so you can 'change' cams and bits and pieces to get an idea of what will work for your motor. Your exhaust note will be pretty good with a combo like that but beware of the EPA

jeff
 

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Not Fast Enough, Dammit!
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302 Posts
I'm not too sure broomy about the clevo, but what happened to the rotor?
 

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If you're running LPG you can probably get away with Closed Chamber (302) heads (CC = more compression). Go 2V not 4V. 4V are only good for super hi-po high rev applications, too much for most street cars.
For cam selection you would need to go to a reputable cam manufacturer such as Crow Cams and tell them details of your car (other work done to your motor, weight, transmission, diff ratio, street/strip use).
The XYGTHO had the best exhaust note of all the Fords I reckon, they used HM headers and these were of a tuned length type through a 2.25 inch exhaust to a special sports muffler at the rear then 2 inch tailpipes. However they were subject to a recall and fitted with extra front resonators in the early stages to quieten it down. This exhaust should still be available through your local exhaust shop or try http://www.gtfordperformance.com.au/.
 

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blue blooded ford fan
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190 Posts
Discussion Starter #9
EPA can go suk my fat one. hehe. if i get hassled, ill just get a nice flange plate :) the rotor is fine i just change cars all the bloody time. hehe im hopeless. nuthin wrong with it, its just a little too old and i dont wanna spend money on interior, brakes etc when i know im not gonna keep it. all this wont be going ahead for a while thou, probably not until december/jan. also gotta find a job first too!!! anyone know where i can get a job in the IT industry with no expereince and no qualifications. hehe
 

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blue blooded ford fan
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190 Posts
Discussion Starter #10
well the have HM Phase 3 headers there for 650, and i can get the rest of the exhaust made up dirt cheap. :)
 

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Administrator
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5,119 Posts
Broomy said:
well the have HM Phase 3 headers there for 650, and i can get the rest of the exhaust made up dirt cheap. :)
Broomy the genuine Phase 3 headers are a 4 piece set and are for the 4v heads.Dyno says they are worth 40 horses.780 cfm holley is worth 35 horses.
List 4bll 780 cfm holley=35hp increase for 2V & 11hp for4V
Camshaft solid lifter D1ZZ-6250-B =49 hp increase 2V & 4V
Headers Phase 3=40hp increase 2V&4V
4V Closed Chamber Heads =36hp increase 2V
This is from a Ford super ROO performance equipment manual I still have from when i played with Phase 3's
 
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I had 245 rwhp out of my Cleveland and all that was done is:
2V Closed chamber heads with hardened valve seats
302 Rods resized ( longer rod give better rod angle etc )
ACL Duralites with moly rings
Cam Dynamics 214 int 224 exh @.050
351 crank reground and balanced
600cfm Holley for auto
block rebored .030
Edelbrock Performer manifold
all this was on stock dual exhaust, 2.92 diff ratio and a sloppy C4 trans
Without listing the other parts the engine cost me $4000 including new manifold and carby and putting it together myself.
 

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5,316 Posts
like anything, it all has to be matched. The Phase 3 headers are actually 4-2-1 ..... If you went all 4v stuff just run a lower diff ratio.
I used the before mentioned XB as a daily driver for a while... everything was supposed to be bad for daily driving ... but it was a pussy ... except for the clutch ......
The thoughts I have are 2vs, not ported but more cleaned up with 3 angle valve jobs, port matched on the inlet, small carby with the choke milled off and all the casting smoothed out, a 2v torker, 4 into 1 headers with the longest tubes possible before the collector and a smallish cam with high lift, low duration and high overlap advanced about 4-8 degrees.... that is *supposed* to give lots of torque down low and heaps of power. All the setup is for velocity rather than outright flow.
Oh, and when the EPA get you you have the potential of far more fines than the cops can level at you !!! Been there and done that.
 

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Two SC 61's = trouble
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6,360 Posts
Try intake and exhaust tongues 33% increase in air speed insert volume 30cc for 4v heads ie stock=485 feet per second
with tongues on 4v =642 feet per second
=4v top end with the low end torque of a 2v...
On Clevo...
 

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Australian ED XR6 Member
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569 Posts
XACOUPE - just out of curiosity. What sort of dizzy was you running on the XB (with the misfire around 5500 - was it points??)
 

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it was the most clapped out dual point Scorcher dizzy.... I should have put something decent in and it would have gone better... you live and learn. Now I have a new XD type electronic dizzy... no problems !

jeff
 

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Administrator
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XA coupe said:
like anything, it all has to be matched. The Phase 3 headers are actually 4-2-1 .....
The genuine Phase 3 headers are in 4 separate parts, each is a 2into 1 pipe ending down near the gearbox tailshaft with 4 separate outlets.
 

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Administrator
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XA coupe said:
do you mean 4 exhaust pipes out the back ???????

jeff
As the headers are in 4 separate bits they end with 4 outlets down near the gearbox.They are long with one on each side hooping out and then back in to give the tuning.Pretty fancy stuff but there is a type of collector that is pushed on to the ends that pull them back to the twin pipes.To fit them on they are in separate parts.You could carry the 4 outlets on if you wanted quad pipes tho.Part No's :XY-9B430-A RH Front ,XY-9B431-A LH Front,XY-9C430-A RH Rear,XY-9C431-A LH Rear. I doubt these parts are still valid but interesting.I'll scan a pic.The phase 3 engines were awesome.
 

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Ah, I understand where you are coming from now ... are they like tuned length headers ?? ie 4 -1 ?? I believed that they were interference (4-2-1 ) design

jeff
 
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