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Discussion Starter #1
It appears Craig Lowndes lost the overall race win at Sandown solely because of hit Top 15 Shoot-out performance.

Lowndes had a 2nd, 3rd and 1st giving him his final tally of 242 points. All earned over 152 laps of Sandown.

Kelly had a 3rd, 1st and a 3rd giving him 234 points from his 152, and 14 points from a single hot lap.

Doesn't seem right to me. Lowndes will be kicking himself - whilst smiling (of course) - for perhaps trying too hard during the shoot-out. At least Lowndes/GMS play by the rules, and managed a galant 2nd including the race 3 win. AVESCO needs a serious look at how HRT are being treated before next year starts.

Congrats to Lowndes/GMS and Ambrose/SBR (and Ford!) for a top performance. Bring on 2002.
 

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Mr. Embargo
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Thanks for clearing up for me why Lowndes didn't win. I wish the inept ch 10 commentators said something.
 

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EA Wagon Member
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aint the first time qualifying has had a say in a result

last year at calder after the first two race rat was leading overall on points yet because of the stupid reverse top 6 thing and taking results from qualifying and race 2 for teh starting positions of race 3 the rat started from 3rd or 4th i forget which one now this was stupid because he finished the first race first and made up a few positions in the reverse race but the stupid rule meant he started behind both richards and lowndes and then richards just kept his distance and although rat got back to 2nd position in race 3 meaning he was obviouslly the better driver for the round getting a race win making a few positions in race 2 and then a 2nd in race 3 he didn't win the friggin round!!!

how can a guy who has most points after first 2 raced not start from pole then work his way back to 2nd even from this shit rule and not win the god damn round!!!!!!! argh!!!!

stupid rules i say and they always favour the opposing teams

even look at poor ingall if in 98 they used the 99 points system he would be champion and if in 99 they used the 98 points system he would have been champion, at least i think it was those years or was it 97 and 98 jeez its late and i forget now

my point is though that the rule changed along the way always seem to work out best for the bad guys lol
 

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The SparkleHunter™
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Hopefully the points system will be changed next year. I reckon it's a joke to be sitting on 3300 odd points at the end of the year. Go to the cart or WRC points system. Much fairer for all concerned..
 

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Evil Holden Overlord
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Everyone is under the same points scheme - why is it a problem?

If Craig had not had the problem in the hot lap and scored enough points to win, I doubt this thread would exist ...
 

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gone
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Hobbes said:
Everyone is under the same points scheme - why is it a problem?

If Craig had not had the problem in the hot lap and scored enough points to win, I doubt this thread would exist ...
I agree with hobbes on this..

Fair is Fair....

..
 

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The SparkleHunter™
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Hobbes said:
Everyone is under the same points scheme - why is it a problem?
I think the only real problem is the double points rounds. If you cock up one of these rounds you can basically kiss the year good bye, which I reckon is wrong. Look at WRC. McCrae stuffed the first 3 rallys, won 3 on the trot and he's right up there for the title.
 

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The only issue I have with the points from the weekend is that if Skiafe had got a stop go when he should have, then lowndes would have finished 3rd in race 2 and have enough points overall to win the round, but that goes back to HRT not getting the penalties they deserve....

As for the qualifying points ystem, fair is fair everyone else has put up with it all year, everyone has known about it all year, so you can't really complain about it now.
 

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Shhh, we're hunting Lions
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Tell me why you should get points for qualifying up the front. The opportunity of starting towards the front of the grid should be enough incentive to do well in qualifying without receiving points.
 

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Discussion Starter #11
Hobbes said:
Everyone is under the same points scheme - why is it a problem?

If Craig had not had the problem in the hot lap and scored enough points to win, I doubt this thread would exist ...
True to a degree, but I disagree with the whole concept of the Top 15 shootout, and the points applied to it vs the points given to 48 laps of a race.

If points were awarded for the actual qualifying session itself which consists of many laps, rather than one single lap then it would be fair. Top 10/15 is just a TV thing.

I'm sure if the shoe was on other foot, Holden fans would be posting the EXACT same thing.

At least we have a significant beef with race officials AGAIN hand-slapping HRT when other teams cop more significant punishment.
 

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Tickford Ruled; FPV Rocks
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I think the points system is a littler ridiculous looking (thousands of points is way OTT IMO) and not quite in step with other forms of motorsport that I am aware of.

Fair enough everybody is subject to the same points system, but what's fair is fair; HRT getting fined was BS and not a punishment at all. When Lowndes passed Murphy inadvertantly under a yellow, why didn't they just fine him, if this is a legitimate form of punishment?

I don't get how a guy who finishes 2nd, 3rd and 1st, comes 2nd overall to a guy who comes 3rd, 1st and 3rd. get rid of qualifing points, it fudges the figures.

And this is not about Ford vs Holden, either. But I suppose everyone is happy as long as AVESCO looks after TWR.
 

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Evil Holden Overlord
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Uhh, since Lowndes finished in front of Skaife in race 2, what difference would it have made if he had a stop/go or not? Personally I think he should have, but I'm not making the decisions.

Be careful not to confuse the issues...
 

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Shhh, we're hunting Lions
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It was good to see that Skaife got what he deserved in the final race, maybe if he had the stop & go his incident might not have happened.

I can't see why they don't just scrap the points for qualifying and make the points system more inline with others eg like CART.
Maybe the pole sitter should receive something but not everyone else (for qualifying).
 

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Tickford Ruled; FPV Rocks
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Hobbes said:
Uhh, since Lowndes finished in front of Skaife in race 2, what difference would it have made if he had a stop/go or not? Personally I think he should have, but I'm not making the decisions.

Be careful not to confuse the issues...
Me get worked up and confuse an issue? NEVER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 

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Discussion Starter #16
I think the racing would be much better if each round was one race, ala Formula 1. The Top 10/15 shootout is silly (a Bathurst novelty gone crazy) and I don't like multiple-race sprint round formats either.

The longer races always prove to be enjoyable to watch. Having one pit-stop was a good start, but a single race with multiple stops, including fuel (which introduces the old fuel consumption strategies and dramas, ala Bathurst) would be even better.

Agree with Hobbes, Craig didn't lose the round due to Skaife, but rather his Shoot-out performance. It's worth noting that had he gained a higher shoot-out position, his overall weekend could have been worse!
 

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Hobbes said:
Uhh, since Lowndes finished in front of Skaife in race 2, what difference would it have made if he had a stop/go or not? Personally I think he should have, but I'm not making the decisions.

Be careful not to confuse the issues...
Whoops, I got bad info from someone that said skaife was in front of lowndes and couldn't remember myself, damn.

sorry bout that. :crazy1: :dead:
 

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Discussion Starter #19
That was probably my fault DK. I was under the impression Lowndes was 4th in race 2, Skaife third, but worked out it was the other way around later (see first post, has correct positions/points). Even with 3rd, Lowndes was still missing points from the shoot-out, Kelly gained 14 from his 3rd. Seeing as the shoot-out accrues points, Kelly finished 3rd, 3rd, 1st, 3rd and Lowndes 14th, 2nd, 3rd, 1st.
 

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Shhh, we're hunting Lions
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Points for the top 15 shootout is crap, imagine if they gave out points for qualifying in F1. Michael Schumacher would win the title purely on his qualifying.
 
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