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P1mp Daddy
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518 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
Hi Guys,

Ive been wanting to do some modifications to my car for sometime now, especially now since im coming up to my first year aniversary of having my P's.

The first thing I want to change in the stock handling of my ED futura.

Ive had a bit of read about the whiteline package avalible and also a bit about the pedders setup. Noticing that some people have said that the pedders setup isnt as good as the whiteline setup. Im not really sure if its worth it to pay extra.

So has anyone had any experience with either packages here?


Cheers

Will
 

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698 Posts
Ive got a K-Mac Springs, shocks, and swaybars kit. Cost about $1300 fitted (3 months ago).

I am very happy with it.

A friend put Whiteline Lowered springs on his VR Commodore. Very good as well.

The KMac, you can specify the spring height (How much you want the car lowred). Not too sure If you can do this with whiteline springs ???

Definitely worth doing, whichever place you take it to.
Falcons Standard Handling (I think ED's are a little better than EF's) is very scary.
 

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Territory TS - AWD
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2,374 Posts
Xyphoid said:
Falcons Standard Handling (I think ED's are a little better than EF's) is very scary.
It's scary and EA thru to EF (I think) all suffer from it. It is largely because the rear roll centre is too high compared to the front roll centre. This was corrected on the EL and some Tickford models.

The Whiteline kit addresses this to some degree by relocating the lower trailing arm on the rear, don't know if the other companies do this or just "mask" the effect through stiffer spring/shock/bar combo's.

Also the EL, Tickford models also had the watts link location on the diff lower.

I may have got the timing/models slightly wrong but to properly take away the scary/unbalanced feeling these pick-up points need to be relocated to alter the inherent geometry.
 

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Pursuit Reincarnation Dog
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7,777 Posts
I just hope Whiteline have improved on quality from when I have tried their stuff. Things like swaybars that have different lengths side to side, inconsistent wire diameters on both their coils and swaybars, and poor surface finish causing binding in the bushes.

I am not the only one that has stopped using their stuff!

My picks from experience setting up prod racing cars:

Shocks - Bilstein
Springs - King or Eibach
Swaybars - K-Mac (surprisingly good for Aussie models)
Bushes - Nolathane (be careful where you use non-rubber bushes!)

Key to making a car handle and ride well is the shocks. They will be the most important factor in whatever you do!
 

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BSR Field Agent
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578 Posts
Mate!!!!!!!!! The Old ED Futura..

Have a look at the Thread in the Showroom "My ED Futura" thats my old car. I put the full Pedders Sports Rider System on. I did have a look at the Whiteline products, however I was warned off them due to poor quality in the build. (Just like AP has said).

Just a word of advice with the ED. Before you change the suspension have all the bushes checked and upgraded to nolathene. I did it and you won't believe the difference it made. In particular the Sway bar mounts, and trailing arm rubbers. If you are lucky like I was I had the Tickford trailing arms on mine. Apparantly Ford trialed them on the Futura.

I then Dropped the Springs 30mm front and rear and fitted Pedders Sports Rider Struts and Shocks. Watch your exhaust if you go to 2 1/2 inch it gets tight over the diff with a load in the car.

I was very happy with the Pedders and the extra firm ride they gave me..

Nipper..
 

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P1mp Daddy
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518 Posts
Discussion Starter #7
Thanx guys for the informative responses. Appreciated.

Now Nipper, about the tickford trailing arms... can you actually buy them and get them fitted on ?

I'll prolly end up droping the front 20 mm and the rear 50mm, cause the car already looks really dumped at the front and its got a really high ass (esp when there is no fuel in the car).

Im actually willing to spend a fair bit on the suspension and rims, simply cause i'd like the car to have great handling. I drove my friends VS that has had its suspension done and it drives soooo much better than it was stock though. Simply unbelievable, you can definately say that Aus cars are tuned for families.

Now with the setup that AP mentioned. How much would that prolly come round to? I have absolutely no idea how much. Are there any web places i can have a quick look at just to find a round about price?


Cheers

Will
 

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BSR Field Agent
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578 Posts
bigred said:
Thanx guys for the informative responses. Appreciated.

Now Nipper, about the tickford trailing arms... can you actually buy them and get them fitted on ?
Will
To be honest, I don't know!!

The only way I found out that I had them was when I was getting all the rubbers replaced the standard Ford did not fit. It was then that we found it had the same trailing arms as the Tickford ED's and needed different bushes..

Remember Will, that your car may look low in the front now because the shocks and springs have sagged. Once you put new shocks in they will hold it a little higher.

Nipper...
 

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Territory TS - AWD
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2,374 Posts
Aussie Pete said:
My picks from experience setting up prod racing cars:

Shocks - Bilstein
Springs - King or Eibach
Swaybars - K-Mac (surprisingly good for Aussie models)
Bushes - Nolathane (be careful where you use non-rubber bushes!)

Key to making a car handle and ride well is the shocks. They will be the most important factor in whatever you do!
Can't argue with that combination or advise. :thup:
I personally have had Bilstein and K-Mac on earlier cars and they are both top quality (are K-Mac still coating everything in orange plastic - yuch!). Also used nolathane on sway-bar mounts, it really sharpens up the response - no more squishy rubber. I have been advised not to use it on all suspension points however.

Aussie Pete said:
I just hope Whiteline have improved on quality from when I have tried their stuff. Things like swaybars that have different lengths side to side, inconsistent wire diameters on both their coils and swaybars, and poor surface finish causing binding in the bushes.

I am not the only one that has stopped using their stuff!
Wasn't aware of this, thanks for the heads-up AP.

Currently I have some mild Peddars stuff on the ED, (camber/caster kit, touring shocks) seems to be OK, certainly better than original.

Nipper said:
If you are lucky like I was I had the Tickford trailing arms on mine. Apparantly Ford trialed them on the Futura.
Damn, I knew I should have gone for a Futura instead of the GLi Classic.
 

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T5 Expert Operator
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6,540 Posts
Nipper said:
Mate!!!!!!!!! The Old ED Futura..

Have a look at the Thread in the Showroom "My ED Futura" thats my old car. I put the full Pedders Sports Rider System on. I did have a look at the Whiteline products, however I was warned off them due to poor quality in the build. (Just like AP has said).

Just a word of advice with the ED. Before you change the suspension have all the bushes checked and upgraded to nolathene. I did it and you won't believe the difference it made. In particular the Sway bar mounts, and trailing arm rubbers. If you are lucky like I was I had the Tickford trailing arms on mine. Apparantly Ford trialed them on the Futura.

I then Dropped the Springs 30mm front and rear and fitted Pedders Sports Rider Struts and Shocks. Watch your exhaust if you go to 2 1/2 inch it gets tight over the diff with a load in the car.

I was very happy with the Pedders and the extra firm ride they gave me..

Nipper..
Yeap i can vouch the pedders sports rider sockies are great, definitly improved the wagon heaps. Springs i got Kings on the front and just blocks on the back.

Hmm might change the sway bar bush's to nolathene then after reading this thread.
 

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i can vouch for whiteline...

i've got koni shocks and whiteline springs, and i'm bloody happy with them! next thing, i'm doing swaybars, and that will be whiteline as well.
 

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P1mp Daddy
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518 Posts
Discussion Starter #12
ahh..

Definately hard to find a good source of information about suspension. The funnything is the conflicting nature of everyones advice.

I dont know. Whiteline seems pretty professional, and he website does give alot of information. Then again its hard to tell workmanship from a website.

I looked at my rear tyres today, noticed they were going bald, prolly be booking myself for a new set of wheels as well. Most likey going some nice AU rims and 17inch. The way I see it, i can get the suspension and wheels done at the same time, and also make one call to the insurance company.

Speaking of insurance, i spoke to the RACV a few days ago (down at Chadstone). Concerning mods, basically as long as its not supercharger, turboing or head/cam work its all good. However they couldnt give me a cost estimate oof what the rest would add to my premium.

And it its tickford components, then they dont really care ...hehee


Cheers

Will
 

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i have done quite a few suspention upgrades when i worked at jax tyres, particularly on falcons. for the best results i would choose something similar to the bilstien, king, k-mac, nolathain combination mentioned above.

BUT!!

make sure you way up the benefits you want with the price you pay. almost any sports kit will give a huge improvement over standard, but you can double the price of the kit and only get a small improvement over the cheaper one.

good hunting!!
 

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Pursuit Reincarnation Dog
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Forgot to say. One of the best places to start for the handling on the ED would be to add the trailing arms, Watts-Link mounts etc from the EL Tickford suspension kit. Stops that "Oh my god here comes the rear end" feeling.

Seeing as you have said you are willing to spend some money, start with Ford Parts and get trailing arms, bushes, and all other parts from the XR/Tickford suspension package except of course bars, springs, and shocks. Then add the Bilstein and King Springs.

Maybe partsguy could look up the parts for the Ford rear end upgrade for everyone's benefit. They would be worth every cent having driven an EL XR!
 

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Yeah, top idea AP !!!!!
I would definitely be interested in the cost for this !!!!!
Pretty Please Parts Guy, (Asking nicely)
How much for the parts needed, excluding springs shocks, and swaybars.
 

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P1mp Daddy
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518 Posts
Discussion Starter #16
cheers

I must definately thank everyone who has contibuted to this thred. Before starting it i had some idea, but as some might say, a little bit of knowledge can sometimes be a bit dangerous. It really is definately hard sometime to tell the adverts and marketting from the truth and factual information.

Forgot to say. One of the best places to start for the handling on the ED would be to add the trailing arms, Watts-Link mounts etc from the EL Tickford suspension kit. Stops that "Oh my god here comes the rear end" feeling
definately know what your talking about there. That nearly killed me 3 days after getting my p's caused about 2000 worth of front end plastic damage. Scary stuff.

I suppose all we need are the exact parts (and or part numbers)required to do the tickford parts upgrade. It would definately be of help to those of us who arnt really in the know about the finer points of suspension.

I think the general consensus would be the following
  • king/bilstiens all around
  • koni shocks?
  • kmac sway bars
  • all other stuff tickford

Funny thing you should mention the cost/spending a fair amount of cash. The thing is, you always get what you pay for. And in the end if you go cheap its always gonna cost you. Ive been tinkering with stereos for a while and have spent far too much already AND i would have spent less if i didnt buy everything twice. Already brought 2 set of speakers, that would have added up to the splits i want... ahhh well.

A wise man never makes the same mistake twice.

Cheers

Will
 

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OH! mind you, i am talking about whiteline components, but i wouldn't go to them for instalation! the bolt holding the shock attached to the axle came a bit loose after about two weeks. i was NOT impressed by that, and i'm pretty reluctant to go back to them now.
 

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The cat in the hat
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Who rattled my cage???

OK OK, but only because you asked nicely!!

I'll start with the easy stuff....

Lwr rear trailing arms are the same as std except for Nolathane bushes being fitted.
Upper arms were different..
R/H upper arm is $71.50 part no. ELTVE 5501 A
L/H upper arm is $71.50 part no. ELTVE 5A803 A
Brkts for re-locating the front mounting point of upper arms are about $110.00 ea. part no's EFTVE 5A914 A/ EFTVE 5A915 A
Bushes for the upper arms are $24.00 ea x 4 part no. EF 5A638 A
plus a couple of bolts & nuts etc.... too lazy for part no's...

Rear diff cover, which includes Watts linkage pivot pin from the EL is $123.00 part no. EL 4033 A
 

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Australian Falcon Member
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Hey partsguy, when you mention "Brkts for re-locating the front mounting point of upper arms" - what are they all about? - I ask because I had Tickford style upper arms fitted a while ago (the mount holes for them needed to be redrilled on the axle housing) - but no-one said anything about the forward mountings for them needing to be different.
 

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The cat in the hat
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On EF/EL XR's they use a mounting bracket at the front that changes the position as well....dont know if these are necessary on the EB/ED but I put the price in anyway..BTW what model tickford upper arms did you have fitted? EBGT or EF/EL XR?
 
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